Seems 3D Realms are pretty excited about a new content delivery system caled Games xStream, so much so they intend to use it for their future (DNF anyone?) game releases. Sounds very similar to the STEAM idea, hell the name even has steam in it!

Game xStream™ is an end-to-end gaming-on-demand system that delivers the most demanding, graphic-intensive games on-demand. By using advanced, patent-pending game distribution and streaming methodologies, xStream™ is scalable to millions of gaming subscribers who can play the latest games online as soon as they hit the market.

Looks like developers are defineately going down this avenue of getting their product to the market via online options ect.

Scott Miller from Realms is quoted:-

"Games xStream is the first and only online delivery platform that can satisfy a gamer's desire to buy a game on impulse and start playing minutes later, regardless of the size or complexity of the game. 3D Realms is extremely excited by this ground breaking technology, and we plan to use it to sell our future releases"

More info over here.

I'm sorry, did you say Games xSteam?

Why can't they just do it the old way...

Go to shop.
Buy game from shop.
Go home.
Install.
Play online with no fu#&ing gay steam bulls***!

Thanks.

I'm sorry, did you say Games xSteam?

hehe yeh, I wonder where they got the idea for this hey? I reckon in 5 yrs there wont be any games shops left, everything will be bought online and everything will need an internet account to play the damn things.

Why can't they just do it the old way...

Go to shop.
Buy game from shop.
Go home.
Install.
Play online with no fu#&ing gay steam bulls***!

Thanks.

Why? Probably something to do with being more profitable for the developers to distribute the games without middle-men publishers.

Sad, but true.. :(


I think the notion that there's no "pre-release" leaks of the game was mighty appealing.

i'm all for content delivery systems such as this, because i'm f***en lazy. plus i dont need any more game boxes lying around.

infact, i get everything i want via the net. music, tv shows, movies, pr0n etc etc..

sif go to shops. thats so 2004.

I feel better when I have the original CD's and all the s*** there...

I dunno, just makes me feel like i got what i paid for...

i agree with strex, this is convenient and the future - embrace it!

If this is going to become standard ISP's will also need to pull their finger out and raise caps to a sufficent level to accomodate the size of games these days. Games nowdays are no longer single CD anymore, multi cd's usually and some now DVD and thats up to 4.7 gig, around a quarter of the basic caps already.

last edited by rubba-chikin at 13:13:54 17/Feb/05

Thanks BPA for my uncapped cable :)

IMO it's good that developers will be getting more money this way and I think games will come down in price by cutting out the middle man.

It is the way of the future really seeing how fast the uptake on broadband is and seeing places like EB cut down there PC games collection.

Someone should have let 3d realms know that before you make a content delivery system, you actually need some content to deliver.

For those that like to complain, you do realise that you'll still be able to make a trip out to your prehistoric "shopping centre" and pick up a copy, right? Because even though they will have an online alternative which will likely be cheaper they will still use archaic CDs for those of you still holding on to the past.

Have fun dealing with crowds, poor customer service, and obnoxious parents who don't seem to give a s*** that their loud f***ing hell spawn are running a muck because they've just run into Betty from nextdoor and have decided to hold a f***ing conversation at the bottom of the down escalators blocking everyones path.

By now the irony of my opening few words has become apparent even to me.

For those that like to complain, you do realise that you'll still be able to make a trip out to your prehistoric "shopping centre" and pick up a copy, right? Because even though they will have an online alternative which will likely be cheaper they will still use archaic CDs for those of you still holding on to the past.

What exactly do you base this on?

What about people that don't have broadband? What about people that DO have broadband but still get hosed because they don't have sufficient bandwidth to cover all the requests? What about people that buy the game in a store, then take it home to play it and find they have to a) be online to authenticate it and b) download 600mb of updates before their game is playable?

Me, I want to have the option to walk into a shop, buy a box with a DVD in it, take it home and install it. It'd take me less time to do that than it would to downloading a modern game (4gb? Thx, I feel like waiting ten hours to download a game). Also, I want a manual. WHERE'S MY MANUAL!?

I have massive doubts that everything is ready to online digital distribution on this scale, with this much data involved. I know a lot of people here have had no problems with Steam, but I consider it a great example of why this is true - the copy protection on it has proven to be useless. Worse, its a step BACKWARDS, because anyone can generate a random SteamID and get around bans and play online - the CD key authing is non-existent (at the moment). They have insufficient bandwidth for everyone during even off-peak times, causing different users to absorb the slaw at different times. Offline play requires advance knowledge of how to do it before you start the game. The content server setup is, in my humble opinion, poorly designed and not taking advantage of providers like us who would happily donate bandwidth into the global bandwidth pool.

What exactly do you base this on?

The fact that the last few games I've purchased I've done all online, paid less than the marked price of EB's or HN and have had no problems as of yet (although that statement fills me with a sensation of impending doom). They weren't all via a digital delivery service like STEAM and you'd have to be willing to wait a few days but unless I had to have something right now I don't mind paying less even with express delivery and recieveing the product a few days latter.

Obviously these content delivery systems aren't designed for those without broadband but you can't blame a lack of available broadband options in your area on them. My point was that there will be the instore alternative for quite a while yet atleast, which is evident with HL2 and will be so with future 3D Realms titles, if there are any. Broadband isn't even available in my area at the moment but by the time games become only available via digital delivery I'm quite confident that it will be and that any current issues with services like STEAM or this new one will be worked out.

Have fun dealing with crowds

Hah! It gives you something to do while the authentication servers are overwhelmed and unavailable at release-time.

poor customer service,

Compared to none if you buy it online. I don't know whether your arguments are poor or whether my sarcasm detector (bought off ebay for more than retail price) is broken.

I think my personal problem with content systems is the way they try to force you to do things their way, to make it easier and more convenient for them to rake in the cash. It's all it is. Convenience .. for THEM.

but you can't blame a lack of available broadband options in your area on them.

Of course not, that's stupid. You can on the other hand blame them for making things harder for people who don't have broadband. If your situation is not 'standard' (no broadband, etc), then tough s*** ... you are not supported, even though their systems could easily be modified to handle you (HL1 was perfectly playable on dialup ... I couldn't play it after Steam was implemented).

They are just unwilling to give you a second thought. Where's the 'offline' button? That would take at most a few minutes to implement. You have to jump hoops (disable network adapter) to play in offline mode. You can't download an update off FTP if Steam is playing up. Also, Steam drops if your speed drops below a certain threshold, I don't know if this is intention or sloppy programming.

Plus it makes it easier for them to "release now, patch later" ... though I'm starting to not give a s*** ... games aren't that impressive nor have the "wow" factor that they had in the past. With a now bastardised industry, what can you do?

These systems are mainly supported by customers who have been lucky enough to not be plagued by any problems. Even if I had unlimited dsl @ 24Mbps, I still would not support such restrictive systems out of principle.


last edited by parabol at 17:20:33 17/Feb/05

Compared to none if you buy it online.

None is better than poor imo, I'd rather deal with an efficient ATM than a bank teller having a bad day.

In regards to STEAM, I know people on pair gain that play CS:Scource without complaint and that when I turned on my computer with out my modem conected it simply asked me if I wanted to play in offline mode which seems to me to be pretty simple.

The fact is that STEAM has many faults and is far from perfect but that doesn't mean that it isn't a step in the right direction and that content delivery systems like STEAM and this xStream are simply going to become more common. By the time that they are the main system for game distribution, dial-up would be a distant, painful memory for everyone and the current issuses will hopefully be nonexistent. Ofcourse I don't expect it to happen for awhile yet but IMO, it is inevitable. Until they are the norm I'm still going to be ordering my games from online retailers.

I'd rather deal with an efficient ATM

What happens if an ATM eats your card or doesn't give you money? (I've had both happen to me, was stuck waiting for the next business day without cash) You'll have to make several phone calls to get the situation sorted when problems occur. I can withdraw money at my local bank faster than at the ATM outside. If there are problems, I am informed personally ... no generic "error" message. There's no clear cut "this is better".

when I turned on my computer with out my modem conected it simply asked me if I wanted to play in offline mode which seems to me to be pretty simple.

It's simple if you just have a simple modem in a simple configuration. What if you connect through a gateway on a LAN and don't want to disable your network card just to play a damn game then re-enable it afterwards? What if you don't want to active dial-on-demand and just want to play your single player game? Although you may think these "what if" situation are uncommon ... then why are so many people complaining? It's not just me

The fact is that STEAM has many faults and is far from perfect

It's not just about that. It's about the developer telling you when you are allowed to play the game (per-play authentication) and how (through their content systems only, no FTP). It's about control.

dial-up would be a distant, painful memory

I hope so, having being stuck on dialup .. it's horrible (DSL will be installed in few days) :(


last edited by parabol at 18:05:31 17/Feb/05

What about people that don't have broadband? What about people that DO have broadband but still get hosed because they don't have sufficient bandwidth to cover all the requests? What about people that buy the game in a store, then take it home to play it and find they have to a) be online to authenticate it and b) download 600mb of updates before their game is playable?

Well as many issues you can come up with here, they can all be solved by one simple inititive. Being an educated consumer.

If you do a little research before you lay down any significant amount of money or sign any contracts none of your examples should be an issue.
Anyone that does a bit of research into broadband options can find a plan with a generous allowance and anyone that has bought any significant PC game in the last 5 years should understand and expect the need for patches.

It's up to the developers and their marketing vampires to figure out how to keep the ignorant playing their games. Why should we let that hold back options that could benifit those of us that have a clue?
More options is nothing but a good thing for consumers.

Online content delivery also has the obvious potential of delivering releases long before they reach the shelves as there's no need to print a million discs and fold a million boxes. Many people would consider that a good enough reason for a 10 hour download.

Also, I think the last game manual I read was super mario brothers 3. Pro tip: You can swim faster in the frog suit.

download dvd

initial price $50
price after gst & exchange rate $60
Download cost (Size/Cap*price = ~4000/12000*70 ~ $23)

real cost of downloaded dvd game = $83:EB price $80

its actualy more expensive to download a dvd anyway, so its not really cutting out the middle man. the middle man just changed is all. from the publisher to the internet service provider.

this would be cheaper ofcourse if you just downloaded an $800 meg game

I can withdraw money at my local bank faster than at the ATM outside

Oh really?

Which bank and we'll have a race to see.

8-)

Which bank and we'll have a race to see

Haha. ANZ @ UQ St Lucia. You are most welcome to try!

I've gotten deposits down to 15 seconds from the moment of entry.

Edit: Please take the above sentence in the correct context :/


last edited by parabol at 21:41:54 17/Feb/05

Personally, I wouldnt move to an area that couldnt get broadband in the first place, it has become as fundamental as having electricity, a phone line or mobile reception for me.

Well to give these guys their due it is NOT steam. It's their own equivalent. If they have any sort of brain they'll have been watching the steam saga and learning from it.

They're saying that games distributed that way will be playable within minutes. And if you looked at their site and went through some of their doco you'd see that games are analyzed and prepared not just distributed. That would tend to imply that the distribution system is smart - ie: you download the engine and the first bits of content required to play and you start playing. Meanwhile in the background XStream is downloading remaining content.

If they get the distribution network right and take proper advantage off peer distribution (even if it's servers that are peers not players) it could be good. As for the licensing/pay to play, well ultimately we have to expect to pay for a game. A pay to play model could be benefitial to the customers as well as the companies. eg: If they price it low enough you play a game for a couple hours and decide it's crap then you've saved money. It may only cost you five bucks to decide it's crap and you don't want to play it any more. Much better than $80-100 from a shop.

If they have alternate business models so you can buy the game outright then that's fine too. One thing I'd like to see though, would be an approach where if you pay to play it validates you online everytime (necessary in order to charge you effectively) but if you bought it outright you are no longer required to validate online to play. Note: I'm talking single player or *offline* multiplayer here. If you're doing online multiplayer then authenticate everytime.

A system like this had great potential to make life better for both sides, as long as they've taken the consumers into account. My greatest fear is that they're going to take exactly the same approach as Steam and do whatever they like with no consideration for their customers.