Pretty amazing statistic.

Mr Mulder said speed camera fines had failed to reduce Victoria's country road toll, which stood at 110 on September 24, compared with 109 on the same date in 2008.

I hate the way they report statistics like this. Has there been any population growth? Because if there has then you could make the conclusion that the road toll per road user has decreased - which is how the statistic should be presented, as a ratio.

''Speeding fines are a voluntary contribution. If you abide by the speed limit you have nothing to worry about,'' he said.

Hahaha, Steve Frost is a smart-arse.

Source: The Age

''We would be happy for police never to issue a ticket if that meant motorists were no longer speeding, and putting lives at risk,'' Mr Cameron said. ''Our policy is to save lives.''

oh yeah, they wouldn't miss that half a billion dollars at all...

yep, pisses me off - car accident fatalities have gone down by leaps and bounds if you factor in population growth
they had 300+ deaths a year in the 1950s
we have around 300 a year still and this is nearly 60 years later .. something tells me our population has grown a little bit since then, not to mention the sheer amount of cars on the road

you were lucky to have car per family back then, now we regularly see 1 car per person and sometimes more

revenue raising+

yep, pisses me off - car accident fatalities have gone down by leaps and bounds if you factor in population growth
they had 300+ deaths a year in the 1950s
we have around 300 a year still and this is nearly 60 years later .. something tells me our population has grown a little bit since then, not to mention the sheer amount of cars on the road

you were lucky to have car per family back then, now we regularly see 1 car per person and sometimes more

revenue raising+

it's almost like punishment for inappropriate actions has had a negative effect on those actions, or something

No problems here, but if they were doing it right they'd be docking demerit points as well rather than just fining people.

it is revenue raising but you don't have to contribute if you don't want to.

They don't issue demerits for speeding? My last ticket reckons I scored some points...

what do you mean raven?

all speeding fines come with demerit points..

If they were serious about cutting road toll you would have a 2 point license system. 1st offence lose a point and $$, second offence lose license for say 1 week, third 1 month.....etc points are restored after 1 year of no offences. You see how many people will watch how they drive then and if they don't at least we don't have to worry about them being on the road.

I also think anyone who is caught driving on a suspended license should have car impounded/sold/crushed and serve jail time.

Mass, I think it's a fine line. You risk trivialising licenses to the point where people would just drive unlicensed. I think you could have a system like that if you had awesome public transport (so people's welfare didn't rely on their own vehicle as it does now) - but we don't.

^^ if people's welfare relied on it, wouldn't they obey the rules?

I think its more likely that if it was that easy to lose your license you would have everyone that does very poorly under pressure driving all freaked out cause they are so worried about losing their license that you would probably increase accidents.

You can't tell me that if the penalty for driving unlicensed was jail time that people wouldn't stop doing it. I know sure as hell I wouldn't, I'm too pretty for prison.

Unlicensed driver = Cube the car IMO. Doesn't matter who owns the car.
If the regestered owner can prove it was taken without consent then the driver not only gets the unlicensed driver charges but also theft.

You can't tell me that if the penalty for driving unlicensed was jail time that people wouldn't stop doing it. I know sure as hell I wouldn't, I'm too pretty for prison.

Huh?

Last time I was in court a guy in front of me got 12 months jail for driving on a suspended (6th offence or so).

^^ if people's welfare relied on it, wouldn't they obey the rules?

No because it's easy to speed.

And if the Gov't was serious about speeding regulation they'd legislate speed limiters in vehicles.

Also, here no speeding fine, Robbo. *looks for wood to touch*

Yeah I don't see a point in getting excited about changing laws and regulations to stop speeding when technology could do it far more effectively. GPS is already accurate to within a foot which is all you really need to be able to setup some sort of dynamic speed limiting system.

When they reviewed the new Nissan GTR on Top Gear, the car used GPS to detect when you were on a race track and would disable the limiters on the car.

Speeding isn't the cause of all accidents anyway, you'd still have to contend with human error.

Sometimes you NEED to speed though, it's a safety issue.

I'm all for something reasonable like an overall 130-140km/hr limiter on all cars, but I would never support anything that would limit a car on a suburban street into 60/70/80km/hr speeds.

last edited by CHUB at 13:19:54 29/Sep/09

I WOULD GLADLY SACRIFICE MY FREEDOM TO SAVE LIVES!

I can't think of any reason on public roads you would ever need to go 140km/hr+ unless it was trying to flee from the police.

the politicians who banned speeding also banned airsoft. hmmmm

i hope they are gonna use that revenue to like.. save the world via ets n s***! no? oh well... i guess it wasn't really that important after all. :D

No because it's easy to speed.

So because it's easy to break the law, does that mean it should be acceptable to break it?

You follow the rules, or face the consequences. It applies to everything.

I'm all for increased punishments.

I'm all for increased speed limits and regular re-testing of drivers and their vehicles to keep the crap cars and crap drivers off the road so things can progress instead of staying in 1974

i'm also for increased speed limits... but without the extra testing to decide who's crap n who's not. let the road (& subsequent carnage) decide :D inevitably, over-population will become humanity's #1 problem... best start dealing with it now by decreasing public saftey & taking all the road rules away.. mmm anarchy... i want some. ;D

speed limits don't mean alot during a zombie apocalypse

If it was about saving lives, they wouldnt put the cameras in the places they do.

They always pick a spot that has a limit that is lower than it realy should be, like a few hundred meters before it goes from 60-80, when it should have been 80 all the time.

The fixed camera on the leadup to the story bridge, why the f*** is it there? I dont remember an accident on that section of road before the camera.

They should make it easier to dob in people you see doing stupid stuff, surely it wouldnt be hard to make a system that ignores individual complains, or repeated complaints from one person against another, to stop people rorting the system.

The system would eventually identify repeat offenders.

I'm all for something reasonable like an overall 130-140km/hr limiter on all cars, but I would never support anything that would limit a car on a suburban street into 60/70/80km/hr speeds.

what about for drivers like me that are far advanced?

surely we should get special considerations to exceed the speed limit by a great margin due to our awesome driving abilities?

i cant wait until theres chips in cars that monitor the speed youre doing and stops you from going over the speed limit for the area your in.

it's almost like punishment for inappropriate actions has had a negative effect on those actions, or something

My point was not that the rules/enforcement are ineffective, rather that they are quite archaic
We regularly have politicians and cops on TV telling us that hoons are destroying the very fabric of society, threatening to crush cars and ban us from driving forever

I refer back to my original point, why are we hearing this misinformation at all?
% of road deaths have gone down yet they are still pushing for harsher penalties and extra powers (like crushing cars and permanent bans etc)
all of this based on the fact that "more people die on the roads each year" which is just plain bulls***

I'm all for increased speed limits and regular re-testing of drivers and their vehicles to keep the crap cars and crap drivers off the road so things can progress instead of staying in 1974

This.

Don't punish everyone for the actions of a few, they run the risk of distancing themselves even further from the general public

If percent of raod deaths has gone down isn't that evidence that the fine system is working? Isn't their goal to reduce the number of deaths to 0?

What the hell, regular retesting of drivers IS punishing everyone else because of the actions of few people.

last edited by greazy at 19:43:43 29/Sep/09

it could be evidence of improved road and vehicle design...

of course it is, seatbelts weren't in mandatory in the 50s

''We would be happy for police never to issue a ticket if that meant motorists were no longer speeding, and putting lives at risk,'' Mr Cameron said. ''Our policy is to save lives.''


oh yeah, they wouldn't miss that half a billion dollars at all...

+1

does anyone really think the speed limits posted on roads are anything more than arbitrary values for the lowest common denominator (ie. s*** driver in a s*** car)?

There is no reason we couldn't have derestricted roads in places. It worked in NT (till they changed it so NT didn't make other states look bad) and it works in Germany.

Does anyone really think speeding fines are anything more than a tax on the stupid (i.e. people who can't stick to the limits)?

There's no reason we can't have double demerit points all the time. It works on holidays.

does anyone really think the speed limits posted on roads are anything more than arbitrary values for the lowest common denominator

I do, why can we do 110 on some roads but not on other highways?

example the M1 is 110 only part of the way? it basically stops after the council district of beenleigh?
the roads are of just a high grade beyond beenleigh

they're certainly better than the 4 lane road north of Bribie en route to the sunshine coast and they're 110

Does anyone really think speeding fines are anything more than a tax on the stupid (i.e. people who can't stick to the limits)?

why do they have to be stupid? why cant they just be vigilantes?
just beacuse someone says something is one way doesn't mean it has to stay that way
its almost impossible for the average joe to do anything about it, there are plenty of roads around where the speed limits are too low - why not just break the law? its about the only thing we can do

on my drive to work there is always a speed camera on sandgate road, i just slow down for that and I get to work every day without a fine
they put them in the same spots every week ..

last edited by tequila at 22:03:41 29/Sep/09

I can't think of any reason on public roads you would ever need to go 140km/hr+ unless it was trying to flee from the police.

How does 240km/h so I can get to Munich for the Oktoberfest in 5 hours instead of 7

I do, why can we do 110 on some roads but not on other highways?

Exactly, the speeds limits are inconsistent all over south east QLD, and probably everywhere else too.

Theres a major road in jimboomba, Camp Cable Road, its 100 all the way, yet it has houses directly on it with drive ways for cars to pull out etc, yet the double lane beaudesert road throun browns plains, which is basically major highway quality for a decent length is 80k/hour, it makes no sense.

why do they have to be stupid? why cant they just be vigilantes?

Vigilantism is pretty stupid for traffic rules, it won't get things changed. You want to change things, try starting a political party. I'm sure there's enough people out there in QLD who think "I'm a better driver than average, the speed limits are too low for me" so you're sure to pull in the votes.

I'm all for increased speed limits and regular re-testing of drivers and their vehicles to keep the crap cars and crap drivers off the road so things can progress instead of staying in 1974

Yeah, get rid of the man-made laws and go back to the laws of the heavenly father .. he has no speed limits! Let religion advance society

there was a time in history when a black woman couldn't sit down on a bus
vigilantism hoy

saint I'm indignified and angered by your comments

Civil rights and speed limits are soooo similar.

you've missed the point (vigilantism)

Breaking the speed limits as an act of vigilantism is indistinguishable from just being a d******* on the road, so your message is never heard.

Nah, you just made a strawman and he called you out on it. You are pretty good at these strawman things 90% of your posts are them. You and infi.

Does anyone really think speeding fines are anything more than a tax on the stupid (i.e. people who can't stick to the limits)?

So do you like just following whatever rule the government decides to come up with? Ever downloaded music or a movie? Copied a CD? Are the fines and jail time you can get from doing that a reasonable cop for the stupid people who can't stick to the rules?

The problem with Speed Camera Vans are that they are too big and easy to see.

They should make portable speed cameras that can attach to the side of any light pole along the side of the road.

So they don't get stuck putting the camera in the same dirt patch where the van safely fits in. They just have to drop a little sign next to the light pole, sit on a fold-up chair nearby (A bike cop could carry it if it was small/light enough) to keep an eye on it and BAM instant fines! HAHAHAHAHAHAHA


I should patent that.


OPPS too late, it's in the public space now.

Soon they will have things called infringement cameras.

orbitor - Downloading music/movies and copying CDs isn't an issue of safety, so your analogy is inaccurate.

Hey is orbitor doing strawmans? Strawman strawman strawman. So much straw.

ok, so laws only have to be followed, when it's a safety issue?

great to see discussion has evolved thus far. any argument i don't like i will just brand it a strawman. hah!

fpot, your use of the term "strawman argument" is just a strawman argument!

ok, so laws only have to be followed, when it's a safety issue?

No, I'm saying comparing safety laws to intellectual property laws is retarded.

I know! That's what makes it so gay.

orbitor - Downloading music/movies and copying CDs isn't an issue of safety, so your analogy is inaccurate.

i guess that's the thing. you obviously think 60 in a 60 zone is perfectly AOK, but 61 is dangerous.

What does the 60 even mean? Did the government determine that at any speed past 60, cars just all crash into each other? Of course they didnt'. There's no consideration of safety in the specific area. The value of 60 is arbitrary.

last edited by orbitor at 23:08:48 29/Sep/09

last edited by orbitor at 23:12:26 29/Sep/09

Pedestrians get more hurt I guess. Usually if the speed is 50-60 it is in pretty build up areas with heaps of people walking around and stuff... it's the 70-110 zones that generally should be faster.

i guess that's the thing. you obviously think 60 in a 60 zone is perfectly AOK, but 61 is dangerous.

Does anyone actually get fined for doing 61 in a 60?

Strawman expert needed here plz.

I've heard the tolerance is meant to be 3km/h for under 100km/h, so you don't get fined in a 60 zone until you exceed 63km/h.

Nah it is pretty much officer discretion.

i've been driving for like 5 years and not one speeding fine
i'm now driving 10k+ over the speed limit most times

god i'm good...

see i've even made this thread better

I don't really care about speed cameras, I've been hit by them a couple of times and since then I've slowed down to 3kph over the speed limit.

To be fair it is very easy to speed, but there is a big difference between speeding a little and speeding a lot, and they've reflected this fairly in the law. Doing 40kph is just stupid and you don't deserve your license. They are even more fair to say "we'll give it back if you have grounds to use it but if you do it again, we double your suspension if you don't make it through X months".

I'm not really sure there is a problem neccessarily with speeding fines. The reason road tolls aren't lower is because people drive like s***. There's always going to be a % of the population that kill themselves on the road because they are behind 1-2 tonnes of metal which has the power of a hundred or more horses behind it.

If anything laws should be stricter in obtaining and keeping your license with perhaps mandatory safety defensive driving refresher courses paid by the state every 5 years. A lot of non fatal accidents could easily be avoided if women stopped putting on lipstick using the rear view mirror and men stopped googling tits on their iphone.

There's no consideration of safety in the specific area. The value of 60 is arbitrary.

It's arbitrary because to specifically evaluate every single street in the city would be a complete waste of manpower when the vast, vast, vast majority of the time there's nothing wrong with just picking a sane default based on average reaction time, etc, and throwing it out there.

The difference between 60 and 61 is sorta obvious I reckon when you consider the context of the word 'limit', I think. It's the limit at which you're not supposed to pass. It's a reference point which is used for enforcement, nothing more.

I have no problems with speed limits. I know they're not there to piss me off personally. I know I could drive faster and probably be safe. But I also know that I'd increase the risk of an accident to some degree, even though I feel I have pretty awesome reaction times thanks to FPS games for the last 10 years. But MORE importantly for me is those rules exist to protect ME from the other people out there that are giant nubcakes.

The reason road tolls aren't lower is because people drive like s***.

reckon, this fat woman was behind me this morning we were driving along newman road which is one lane each way 60km/h road..

she's on my ass the whole way down i sat just above 60km/h and she was almost looking like she was going to overtake me or something, i thought nah surely not

next thing she f***in goes to overtake me i was like you fat f***ing slut i went back to 3rd but she had the jump on me i didn't sp00l in time and she just got enough room to move over. i would have gladly driven away if she had collected the poles on the traffic island or one of the cars on coming in the other lane.

this happen just before the end of the road which becomes 2 lanes 1 turns either way. she gets into my lane which turns right and turns left from this lane and pushes into the line of traffic turning left.

you fat f***ing mole, i hope you kill yourself in a car accident.

haha tell us what you really think about her Pave :)

The problem with Speed Camera Vans are that they are too big and easy to see.

I don't think the intention of speed cameras in vans is to be conspicuous; I think the intention is more to ensure drivers are paying attention to the road and their surroundings. If someone is speeding and doesn't spot a speed camera, they aren't paying attention and are a danger to themselves and others and should be fined. If someone is speeding and notices the van and slows down, they're paying attention so they aren't as dangerous.

It's arbitrary because to specifically evaluate every single street in the city would be a complete waste of manpower when the vast, vast, vast majority of the time there's nothing wrong with just picking a sane default based on average reaction time, etc, and throwing it out there.

So we suffer as a result of the inability to determine what the real speed should be?
How about when the council goes out to .. I dunno, install the speed sign posts - they actually think about it then and there?
Or you know, when they grade the road?
or perhaps when they do the surveying before laying the road
or maybe, just maybe - when they're planning the road.

This works both ways too (the suffering part), there are quite a few streets out there which are labeled 60 but aren't safe to do 60 on

you can't go labeling every road and street with it's own speed limit, 60 70 60 80 50

that would be ridiculous

yeh the 40/50/60 blanket zones don't bother me so much as the idiotic nanny state 80/90/100/110 zoning, and the idiotic roadworks restrictions which go so far beyond ensuring a safe workplace for roadworkers and into the realm of sheer stupidity that it's not funny

yep, the 80km/hr road works signs should only be active while there are people doing .. wait for it.... road works.

So we suffer as a result of the inability to determine what the real speed should be?

You f***ing suffer?

No, you don't.

It's arbitrary because to specifically evaluate every single street in the city would be a complete waste of manpower

They dont need to evaluate every street, just high trafficed areas, the speed limits are so inconsistent and makes the every k over is a killer slogan stupid.

example if google embeds correctly, this stretch is 80k, its a 2 lane highway with onramps and offramps, doing 80 along it feels way too slow, and they regularly put speed cameras on it, why? becuase a cop station is just off the first exit and its easy for them to go out and nab a few people doing 90 when its no where near dangerous. Its not saving lives, its not doing anything except fining people for no good reason

Fining them for breaking the law I hear u say, i'd rather they spend the time doing something worthwhile than revenue raising.


View Larger Map

also, the are doing roadworks to continue the 2 lanes further south, with overpasses and exits, so the stretch will be about twice as long, and it will no doubt all be 80k for about 10ks when it should be 100k.

last edited by `ViPER` at 10:14:46 30/Sep/09

Also, to further backup my point, 10 minutes down the road towards jimboomba, it goes to 100k, this is when its now a single lane highway that hasnt been upgraded in years, has no overpasses, so you have cars pulling out, has houses with driveways directly onto the highway and is generaly a way worse road, yet its 100k?

^^
It is a valid point Viper makes.

I commute on a motorbike (cause its cheap and faster). I like to think that I'm pretty careful on the road because idiots in their big f*** off Patrols never look out for me. I do speed on certain roads where I know the surface and the traffic. That said I never speed around suburban streets, too quickly kids/dogs/cars are out in front of you and on the bike it'll most likely be me coming off worse.

I got pulled over by the cops the other weekend on the bike. I was riding over to a friends place, following my wife in the car. I pulled out around her (two lanes) and accelerated upto the speed limit pretty fast. I made it through a set of lights that she got caught at, about 200m down the road I turned at a round about. 2 seconds later flashing lights.....pull over driver.

Cops (they looked like kids): Are you aware of the speed limit?
Me: sure its 60
Cops: How fast were you going through those lights?
Me: 60
Cops: We had to speed up and run the light to catch you (they had to be at least 500m behind me).
Me: what does your radar say?
Cops: We're not equiped with one.
Cops: You've been pulled over for the purpose of a license check and random breath test.......

So these idiots broke the speed limit and ran a red light because they thought I was speeding without any evidence....... and yet they would want to give me the fine. Needless to say they just let me go but surely this type of activity is just plain revenue raising, the only hope they could have of actually fining me for speeding is if I was stupid enough to say I was doing 70.

Cops: We're not equiped with one.

horse s***

take viper's example and apply it to the centenary/M5 to see just how stupid it can get, it's 10 times worse there

So we suffer as a result of the inability to determine what the real speed should be?

You f***ing suffer?

No, you don't.

read it again dips***, we suffer DEATHS because some speed limits are too high and we suffer fools because some limits are too low.
this is what happens when you implement blanket policy

I dont think the cops actually believe they are revenue raising, they've got quotas to fill
they *have to* meet certain quotas each month or explain why they cant book X number of speeding fines etc

that kind of policing is bulls***

Heh, I work a lot with roads (and have actually done work on Camp Cable Road) so I'm getting a kick etc :p

Most traffic engineers that I know actually put up slightly higher speeds in their designs (like 110k for the Mt Lindsey Highway stretch) just so a councillor/some paper pusher higher up can say "Hey that's not safe lets make it 100k instead." Whomever in Main roads must of just said 100 and got talked down to 80 :(

The reason Councillors want lower speed limits is because (shockingly enough) thats what the majority of people (that bother to say anything) say they want. The Vocal minority often get heard louder then the silent majority. So next time you see your Local Colouncer (or State member) tell them you want faster speed limits on X road. Send them letters about it. Get everyone you know doing it. It will no doubt take a lot of time (and people) but after a while if enough people want the change, things get changed.

I'm out on 80k roads all the time and I have residents come up to me and say that people are going way too fast on 'their' road and they want them to go slower. There's no reason to go slower on these roads they just want people slower for their own reasons.

I dont think the cops actually believe they are revenue raising, they've got quotas to fill

While this is true for Breath-a-lizers it's really not the case for Speeding tickets (or parking for that matter.) I know cops that use to do 'Rolling stops' to meet the quota (i.e. Partner takes their own BAC while driving to the next sopt/job.)

I'm not sure why someone chooses to become a Traffic Cop, I always have thought it would be punishment if you f***ed something up. Some people like being arseholes though I suppose.

On the topic of s***ty slow speed limits.

f***ing hornibrook bridge, 60km/hr my ass, it's so goddamn painful to drive across it at 60km/hr.

Even 80yo grandmas in a Getz are doing 70km/hr... cops, school bus, even scooters regularly going 80km/hr.

It's complete bulls*** and drags on for far too long, even at 80km/hr it feels extremely safe, 70km/hr feels slow, 60km/hr is just f***ing stupid.

So sick of that goddamn bridge.

well don't live at Redcliffe.

lol thats what you get for living in redcliffe though

Heh, I work a lot with roads (and have actually done work on Camp Cable Road)

Good old camp cable road, thats my stomping ground, Have done over 200k/hour down that road when I was in highschool (mate had borrowed his older brothers v8 statesmen), now thats unsafe! Obviously I dont do that these days.

How can other dual lane highways be 80 when u have roads like camp cable being 100, Not saying that its unsafe to do 100 on camp cable.

the southside gateway arterial s***s me being 80kph because of constant road works... even though nearly everyone does 100kph on it. i'm sure i'll get a fine there one day n i'll be spewin'. also the new section of the northside arterial where it comes off the bridge n is now 4 lanes wide... yet still 80kph ffs. then when it gets past banyo n goes back to 2 lanes it's 100kph.

usually i don't ride in much traffic as i commute a very short distance... but the other day i went to visit my olds in narangba & was pleasantly surprised that the whole of the gympie road freeway traffic was moving north at around 130kph around 5:30pm. i just sat in the traffic doing 130kph along with everyone else... it was sweeeet. :D

take viper's example and apply it to the centenary/M5 to see just how stupid it can get, it's 10 times worse there

Completely agree, stupid f***ing road. Let's make this patch 80, this patch 100, this patch 90, this patch 80 .. stupid. Not to mention all the dumb 60km/hr roadwork signs down the end.

I dont think the cops actually believe they are revenue raising, they've got quotas to fill
they *have to* meet certain quotas each month or explain why they cant book X number of speeding fines etc

Citation needed

The The Vocal minority often get heard louder then the silent majority.

the silent majority, clearly, are relatively happy with state of affairs

Now, I can't really comment, because I walk to work and barely drive more than a few km a week (seriously) - most of my trips are only a few kilometers. But surely for most people, if the speed limits were raised a bit in various roads, at the most you would be saving only a handful of minutes per day - minutes that will just get pissed away when there is more traffic or whatever.

Anyway, roads are doomed; they're just not sustainable in the long term with any real population growth. Give up on them already!

the silent majority, clearly, are relatively happy with state of affairs

Indifferent maybe. Clearly not everyone is happy with the current arangements (though I suspect they would also be a minority.)

For short drives, as you said, it's meerly minutes. So it doesn't really bother me if i'm stuck behind slower car/low speed limits. For long drives though it quickly ads up. If you have to drive quite a bit for work then 5 or so min every trip adds up over the day. Thats not even mentioning the environmental savings of going at a steady speed and not constantly accelerating and decelerating like mentioned for the M5/Centanary stretch.

If we stopped road works i'd lose ~50% of my work load :( Dont you care about Australian workers Trog!?

If we stopped road works i'd lose ~50% of my work load :( Dont you care about Australian workers Trog!?

I'd rather the money funneled into a useful mass transit metro system like other civilised countries have to get around

Indifferent maybe. Clearly not everyone is happy with the current arangements (though I suspect they would also be a minority.)

Well, you have no basis for making that claim - just like I have no basis for making the claim that they're happy. So I guess we're even. But the point is the same.

I'm currently in Beunos Aires in Argentina. People here drive like f***ing crazy nut bags. Seriously, I have been in taxis several times on this trip and I have had to close my eyes because I was sure we were going to at LEAST nudge another car, or at worst impact someone at thousands of miles an hour. They have these insane 9 lane roads (each way) and noone pays attention to lanes. Despite that, the system seems to work. Noone seems to drive particularly fast though - just chaotically. It's really interesting to see how different the driving style they have over here is. I haven't seen anyone die yet so I guess it works for them!

The only way to actually tell if raising speed limits is going to be better is to actually do it and see what happens. If accidents//deaths increase, then its a bad idea. If not, then its a good idea. Risky proposition, right? And not one that I want to put my life in the equation for, considering that - for me - the current system works fine.

Maybe if you quadrupled the population of Brisbane we could start to almost have the required density to make mass transit metro systems like other civilised countries have actually viable.

Maybe if you quadrupled the population of Brisbane we could start to almost have the required density to make mass transit metro systems like other civilised countries have actually viable.

yeh, this is a common complaint, to which my answer is, if we wait until we NEED it, it'll be too late to put it in, especially if we're putting stupid ass roads and tunnels everywhere in the meantime

The population of Brisbane, and any Australian capital (thanks in no small part to the retarded "hey lets pay our citizens to have babies" scheme) is only going one way. I don't want any of our cities to end up like LA - giant s***holes with cement and bitumen f***ing everywhere. That's what'll happen if we keep throwing down roads.

Pfft, they could at least build a central hub for a metro system in Brisbane so when the time comes they don't have to start from square one.

also the new section of the northside arterial where it comes off the bridge n is now 4 lanes wide... yet still 80kph ffs. then when it gets past banyo n goes back to 2 lanes it's 100kph.

Thank f*** I'm not the only one who also thinks this is the most RETARDED speed setup on that new piece of pristine road which you could easily do 150 without blinking. But no... some retard decided to make it hard 100..80..100. THE ROAD DOESNT CHANGE YOU f***WIT! Why do we have retards making the laws? Why ? Surely there has to be one person in the group of retards governing the speed laws on big, long, new stretches of highway that has common sense.

last edited by Skitza at 18:01:18 30/Sep/09

also the new section of the northside arterial where it comes off the bridge n is now 4 lanes wide... yet still 80kph ffs. then when it gets past banyo n goes back to 2 lanes it's 100kph.

Thanks f*** I'm not the only one who also thinks this is the most RETARDED speed setup on that new piece of pristine road which you could easily do 150 without blinking. But no... some retard decided to make it hard 100..80..100. THE ROAD DOESNT CHANGE YOU f***WIT! Why do we have retards making the laws? Why ? Surely there has to be one person in the group of retards governing the speed laws on big, long, new stretches of highway that has common sense.

there is probably a system in place that allows you to call up and inquire as to why it is like this... I'm sure it's not like that by sheer randomness, and if it is, its probably an oversight that exists solely because noone has actually followed the appropriate process to complain about it

I'm currently in Beunos Aires in Argentina. People here drive like f***ing crazy nut bags. Seriously, I have been in taxis several times on this trip and I have had to close my eyes because I was sure we were going to at LEAST nudge another car, or at worst impact someone at thousands of miles an hour. They have these insane 9 lane roads (each way) and noone pays attention to lanes. Despite that, the system seems to work. Noone seems to drive particularly fast though - just chaotically. It's really interesting to see how different the driving style they have over here is. I haven't seen anyone die yet so I guess it works for them!

sounds like melbourne

Maybe if you quadrupled the population of Brisbane we could start to almost have the required density to make mass transit metro systems like other civilised countries have actually viable.

Pretty sure they're looking into a subway system for Brisbane .. at least for inner Brisbane anyway. Because as Trog said, they realise they need to do it now before it becomes too late.

Too bad s***ty QLD has no money left and a f***off massive debt.

Now, I can't really comment, because I walk to work and barely drive more than a few km a week (seriously)

yet here you are, commenting!

on the other hand, I drive from the brisbane outskirts (in fact from another shire), into indro each day and back and I disagree with most of what you're saying. at least until next week when I move to indro!

I don't care if they built a train line that went from my very front yard to the front door of our office, I wouldn't want to ride on it as a rule unless I had my own closed off cabin that was as comfortable and easy to carry objects in to/from work as my car

if you're happy riding trains/buses that's great, but you shouldn't assume everyone else is or should be

and roads are the fundamental means of progress because they are far more flexible than train and tram lines. this flexibility is the reason we need them and that they can't take a backseat to public transit as you suggest

Yeh public transport isn't the answer, people don't like being cattle.

I reckon a single-person electric ... mover ... would be awesome! Ride the bike lane, and has enough room to put a couple bags in and is sealed to prevent you from getting wet and s*** and for nice aircons!

Edit: Sort of like this maybe (the bottom sealed in one, not the top old man gimpy wheelchair looking one).

last edited by Hogfather at 12:42:50 30/Sep/09

so a smart car basically hoggy

the current system works fine.

Given that as you said, you only drive a few k's a week, no offence but you realy cant say if the system works or not, given that alot of other people who drive a fair bit have the same complaints, the system obviously doesnt work.

I think what everyone is getting at is that the speed limits on alot of roads dont seem to be based on the actual road conditions, hence the every k over is a killer slogan and the fining of people for breaking the speed limits that seem to be wrong is stupid.

Having the wildly variable speeds that dont seem to match the conditions just undermines the point the government is trying to make.

Is that what it is?

I may be slghtly out of touch, maybe ...

one of those little cars would be fine for certain roads, but again youd have to make specific lanes for them, I sure as s*** wouldnt drive one of them on the same road as a truck/4wd, I dont care how much engineering goes into making it safe, a truck would f***en crush you in an accident.

I sure as s*** wouldnt drive one of them on the same road as a truck/4wd, I dont care how much engineering goes into making it safe, a truck would f***en crush you in an accident.

Yeh absolutely! Like I said maybe you could get one small enough to fit into a bike lane or something.

I've just always thought that hauling around a few tonnes of 5-seater was a waste to get me to and from work or down to the shops! While I'm a recreational motorbike fan I don't want to ride one every day, and I hate people too much to car pool.

I drive 40km's a day to and from work but spend 90 minutes in traffic. The roads i take are - moggil road - Western freeway - Milton road - Innercity bypass - sandgate road.

These are all major roads, the average speed should be about 70kp/h but on average i'm moving at 35-40kph. If it wasn't stop start, and 40kph the entire way there I'd be happier for the extra mileage i'd get.

Here's a road that makes no f***ing sense:

Inner city bypass heading outbound, you hit an 80zone on the downhill straight after getting on at hale street. It then drops to 60kph because there is an EXIT ramp? It jumps back up to 70kph in time for the congestion that backs up from kingford smith drive all the way back to sandgate road turnoff.

Why does it go to 60kph? It makes no sense. There's no dangerous hazards, they aren't afraid of people going fast in the tunnel because the speed doesn't change till you are halfway through the tunnel.

Roads like that anger me because it f***s up the traffic. People speed, and thats fine because the important most safest way to drive is to follow the traffic speed and not be a hazard. But when you get some trucks slowing to 60kph in one lane, and other trucks changing lanes to avoid slowing down and people who want to exit but don't want to be in the slow lane it causes chaos. I havn't seen an accident there, but the likelyhood of an accident is much higher when the traffic becomes unpredictable.

Edit:
I forgot to throw out my opinions about public transport.

It should be a heap better than it is. People who say s*** like "I don't want to ride in cattle class" can just drive their suv if they like. I don't care. But as it stands, it should be a viable economic alternative both monetarily and timely. Every year they tax roadgoers more because they want to encourage public transport but the few times i catch a bus or train they are completely packed beyond full. Also it takes me 35minutes longer to catch a bus and then a train to work then it does driving.

Public transport shouldn't be mandatory but it should have enough advantages to be an alternative.

last edited by skythra at 13:23:02 30/Sep/09

last edited by skythra at 13:23:32 30/Sep/09

I would happily get public transport to work. Unfortunately Brisbane is one great big s***hole for public transport. To get to work on time I would have to leave home 2hrs before start.....walk 4kms to a bus stop. Catch bus to city, catch ferry over river and then walk 3kms to work. Bloody stupid, and don't get me started on the trains.....!

horse s***

i had the same thing dont to me about 3 years ago. it does happen from time to time.

i wasn't doubting they said it to him

that is their way of saying you weren't speeding or they didn't get a reading on you

well they still booked me!

I recently drove from Brisbane to Jindabyne and back via Sydney and Canberra.

If you think we have it bad up here think again... the sheer amount of speed cameras down there is crazy, especially near the city.

They are EVERYWHERE even out in the little s***hole towns... come around this crapola corner in a 50km zone and hello speed camera.

Thankfully the signage is that excessive its virtually impossible to not notice them so if you do get fined you deserve it.

SPEED CAMERA AREA
...
SPEED CAMERA AHEAD
...
SPEED CAMERA WARNING
CAMERA ON A STICK

While on the topic their toll roads are freaky as hell! It's like driving along a freeway full of purple stargates.

Tolls in general were a bitch too... you'd end up on a toll road and then work out there aren't any cash booths and they only take e-tags and theres no offramp to get back off...

last edited by rubba-chikin at 15:22:53 30/Sep/09

why would that make us think again! it's better to have the cameras set up like NSW, you get told when you're about to drive through one

horse s***



i had the same thing dont to me about 3 years ago. it does happen from time to time.

Nope, gotta say I've had the exact same situation as Mass.
I got told I was doing over 100kph in a 50kph zone because they had to clock over 150 to... and I quote... "Catch up to you".

I looked at the guy and basically said that it was firstly, impossible because I had just turned a corner and my vehicle was not even capable of that speed just entering into 2nd gear.
Secondly, the speed they had to do to catch up to me, was clearly in great excess to the speed I was doing given the rate at which the distance was closed.

I pretty much got told to slow down and carry on :/
I'm pretty sure I was doing something like 60 in the 50 zone, but still, 100+ come on :P

Go look up your local police station on Dunn and Bradstreet you will find that they are a registered for profit corporation. Crime is a profitable business and the shareholders want more crimes more policies to earn more money. It's quite simple.

Unless it harms another living man/woman
Loss of property

Then its not a valid law.

Err i got done for 2 fines today

$453

=[

JakeG were you the guy that failed his driving test because you did a turn across 2 lanes? It was someone starting with J, perhaps Jigzie or ummm? Jaborney or something.

Man that thread was LOLZ.... "I got failed EVEN THOUGH THERE WAS NOONE IN THE OTHER LANE", complete with MSPaint picture.

last edited by CHUB at 21:31:21 30/Sep/09

if you're happy riding trains/buses that's great, but you shouldn't assume everyone else is or should be

My point is that I think eventually everyone else will have to be - its not sustainable for everyone to drive their car to work every day, alone, after you pass a certain population size, without turning your entire city into a highway and parking lot. Like LA, which is the ugliest city in the world, and it still has the worst traffic.

and roads are the fundamental means of progress because they are far more flexible than train and tram lines. this flexibility is the reason we need them and that they can't take a backseat to public transit as you suggest

The thing is I think most commuters in most circumstances can easily get on a train/whatever and do the vast majority of their travel quite easily. If you're a tradie or have to move a lot of gear constantly then obviously that's a bit more difficult.

I guess my perspective is too heavily skewed because I just think roads are inevitably doomed and I'd rather do something about it now before Brisbane turns into more of a nightmare of roads splattered all over the landscape.

Given that as you said, you only drive a few k's a week, no offence but you realy cant say if the system works or not, given that alot of other people who drive a fair bit have the same complaints, the system obviously doesnt work.

If their complaint is "the system sucks because I can't drive fast and I want to" then is that really a valid complaint though?! I can appreciate it if it would shave a lot of time off their trip, sure. And if that's the case, and there are sections of road that they feel could safely have their speed increased, they should be lobbying their local council members to get it changed and try and get other people to do it as well.

I definatley did not fail my driving test :P

$333 and 4 points for the speeding fine

Highway police going opposite direction n i shouldnt have been speeding.

Other one was a $120 parking ticket.. I had pay 2 display but got held up 15 mins after 4pm =[

http://img28.imageshack.us/img28/1307/sil80yew.jpg

Err i got done for 2 fines today

$453

suck s***

The thing is I think most commuters in most circumstances can easily get on a train/whatever and do the vast majority of their travel quite easily.

For people that live close to a train/bus line maybe, alot of people that commute into the city live in outer suburbs and the they would have to catch bus then train then bus then walk, taking like 2 hours, which people just arent gonna do.

Add kids into this mix, anyone with kids under about 7 needs a car, then what if u want to something apart fomr just go straight from work to home eg shopping, u arent putting the groceries on the train.

I can see how it can seem so simple to you, a 20/30 something single male (I assume) with no kids who lives close to work and public transport, you dont have to worry about dropping kids to daycare, taking kids to the doctors, doing the grocery shopping with 2 young kids.

If their complaint is "the system sucks because I can't drive fast and I want to" then is that really a valid complaint though?!

I think u missed the point again, the point isnt we just wanna go faster all the time, its that the speed limits on alot of roads are inconsistent with what you would think they would be, under maintaned single lane highways being 100k when 10 mins earlier u were on the same road, but it was a stretch of pretty new dual lane road with overpasses and on ramps and offramps, yet its 80k, it makes no sense. Then the police setup the radars on the 80k stretch because they know people "speed" along that stretch and they are gonna get some easy money.

Its not saving any lives because it wasnt dangerous to do 100 on that road in the first place, how can it be when u can do 100k on worse sections of road legally?

For people that live close to a train/bus line maybe, alot of people that commute into the city live in outer suburbs and the they would have to catch bus then train then bus then walk, taking like 2 hours, which people just arent gonna do.

Which is why Trog wants massive spending on a Transit system so everyone is close to a bus/train line. Unfortunatly the cost to build this in Brisbane is prohibitive. The fact that it wouldn't be fully utilised for another ~20 years (estimated time where Brisbane population would reach the level needed for most basic Metro systems) is a put off. Add to this the running costs/maint/upgrades while we're sitting around waiting for the population to explode and you have a whole lot of wasted money... for a system that will be obsolete by the time it can be used.

Add kids into this mix, anyone with kids under about 7 needs a car, then what if u want to something apart fomr just go straight from work to home eg shopping, u arent putting the groceries on the train.

This is more your mindset, yes it probably would be harder, but most people in London carry their groceries on the train all the time. Instead of doing ~$300 worth of shopping at any given time, they but 1-2 bags worth on the way home from work. A lot of the Stations are extreamly close to services you need Doctor/shopping/etc. It's really just people being lazy and not wanting to do something they percive as harder.

I agree though that Trog is missing the point about the speed limits. We're not complaining about the road network, or having to use it, just some aspects of the abitrary rules applied seemingly with little thought.

trog: you think too city-centric.

Yeah keeping cars out of our high-density areas is likely the way of the future. But there is a vast country outside of the high-density areas of our major cities, and the fact of the matter is a car is the only way to get most places without taking hours and hours with many changes of mode of transport.

also, on the speed limits, don't get me wrong. I'm not objecting to speed limits. I'm objecting to the way they're treated. Cops should be out booking unsafe driving, dangerous vehicles, tired drivers, people talking on mobiles, etc etc. Not simply cashing in on people who might be travelling slightly over a speed limit in a completely safe manner. People travelling well over and driving in an obviously unsafe manner ought to have the book thrown at them.

Yeh good luck on public transport in a place like Cairns...

I looked at the guy and basically said that it was firstly, impossible because I had just turned a corner and my vehicle was not even capable of that speed just entering into 2nd gear.
Secondly, the speed they had to do to catch up to me, was clearly in great excess to the speed I was doing given the rate at which the distance was closed.

my bro in law got done this way as well, man was he spewin

yeah they are dumb s*** traffic cops, what do you expect

they don't understand the concepts of speed and acceleration

This is more your mindset, yes it probably would be harder

Serious question scooter, do you have kids?

None of my own, no.

Not being rude or anything, but wait till u have kids, chucking little kids on a train or bus to go up to the shops or the doctors or to daycare is about the last thing you would want to do.

Not everyone is in that situation though, but our public transport isnt even good enough for most People without kids to use for daily commuting.

We wouldnt need to get everyone off the roads, just maybe like 25% and the current road system would work heaps better, just look what its like during school holidays.

I think you're missing Trogs point (if I even have his point right myself) almost as much as Trog is missing yours.

our public transport isnt even good enough for most People without kids to use for daily commuting.

Trog wants a system built (for the City) that is good enough for Workers/Parents/Commuting.

Also, I've always been a fan of 'let the buggers walk to school.' Parents should live in an area close to the schools they send their kids to school in. It's as/more important then living closer to work. By high school the majority of school children should be able to get to school on their own steam. Healthier for the kids, saves money (fuel/time) for the parents, it's a win/win.

also, on the speed limits, don't get me wrong. I'm not objecting to speed limits. I'm objecting to the way they're treated. Cops should be out booking unsafe driving, dangerous vehicles, tired drivers, people talking on mobiles, etc etc. Not simply cashing in on people who might be travelling slightly over a speed limit in a completely safe manner. People travelling well over and driving in an obviously unsafe manner ought to have the book thrown at them.

Exactly, it seems like all they are worried about is what speed you are doing, backed up by the "every k over is a killer" slogan. Well its not realy every k over is a killer, its people merging without looking on highways that is a killer, its people tailgating thats a killer, its people that arent good enough drivers to even physically drive the car let alone look ahead for potential hazards and avoid them thats a killer, its people with s*** cars with crappy brakes thats a killer, its s***ty unmaintaned roads thats a killer.

You cant setup cameras on the side of the road and cash in on most of those slogans though.

Go to Europe or Japan. Only then can you fully understand that our public transport is a joke.

I know, population density, yada yada yada - but I still think our public transport is far below par. Even really basic things, like a train to the airport in Melbourne.

And `ViPER`, loving school hols at the moment! Roads are awesome during hols.

Trog wants a system built (for the City) that is good enough for Workers/Parents/Commuting.

I agree with him there, more people off the roads the better, but we still need a decent road system for a place like south east qld.

Also, I've always been a fan of 'let the buggers walk to school.' Parents should live in an area close to the schools they send their kids to school in. It's as/more important then living closer to work. By high school the majority of school children should be able to get to school on their own steam. Healthier for the kids, saves money (fuel/time) for the parents, it's a win/win.

Agree there too, people dont need to be dropping high school kids to school, thats stupid, From about grade 4-5 onwards the kids should be able to get themselves to school.

My point is that I think eventually everyone else will have to be - its not sustainable for everyone to drive their car to work every day

You can stop saying this until we're at least the same size as new york.

the speed/acceleration thing is a common line they pull on unsuspecting kids, it probably works on 17 year old kids who smoked too many bongs before math class

I've argued with them about it before and they aren't stupid, they know you aren't doing 150 just because they had to do 150 to catch up to you
I just say "wait, you just did 150km/hr in a 60 zone?" that will shut them up quickly

they mostly just want you to say "but i was only doing 87" and then they turn around and go "oh so you admit you were doing 87, well then here is your fine"

I have recorded a few interactions with the police in my time and I've had my share of license suspensions/cancellations.
what it boils down to is if you're nice to the cop and you "yes sir, no sir" him (or sometimes her) they will quite often just let you be

not one speeding fine or traffic offense to my name for over 12 months now though, I'm a changed man ;)

I got done by a d in an SS ute sitting down the bottom of the big hill on the motorway heading north at mango hill the other day. 113 in a 100, overtaking someone and going down hill :(

if you're nice to the cop and you "yes sir, no sir" him (or sometimes her) they will quite often just let you be

Not with my bloody double white lines at 1.30am they weren't. I couldn't have been any nicer. I even said, "Thanks mate, have a good night." after he gave me the fine. I hope the cop at least felt like a c*** for fining the nicest road user alive. Hehe.

yeah it doesn't always work but as a general rule, I'm nice to them until they've written the fine

seriously, you thanked him for fining you?

'oh yes sir rape me harder'

On the topic of Brisbane's roads, public transport, etc.. I was up there last weekend for a wedding and I forgot how much I relied on a car in Brisbane because the public transport is s*** (even though I was staying within 10min walk to Northgate station).

The city is too spread out with not enough transit hubs to move passengers around and the frequency of services is pathetic. There's just no way Brisbane can sustain the type of public transport system troggles is talking about without a significant investment in infrastructure.

seriously, you thanked him for fining you?

Yeah, well my missus was sitting next to me vomiting in a plastic bag and yelling at the officer - not swearing, just stuff like "he's doing the right thing - this is ridiculous", etc. I had a lot on my mind right at that time. Hahaha.

Now when I get pulled up for a breathalyser and they say, "How are you tonight?" I always reply, "Disillusioned by policing in Victoria, but carry on."

:-))))

After I received my fine I went into the local police station the next day to argue about it and even that copper reckoned I was pretty rough to get it, but there was nothing he could do about it since it's up to the officer at the scene.

did you take it to court?
if a cop thinks its rough, a judge might too

the judge doesn't answer to police, so he can actually nullify it

He broke the law though, his defense would purely be "well it was late at night and noone was around".

Anyway, roads are doomed; they're just not sustainable in the long term with any real population growth. Give up on them already!

It's not the roads that are the issue.

It's the megacity mentality combined with the aussie dream of a house with a yard. It's worse in Brisbane because we really only have a single business center ie. the CBD and apartment living relatively uncommon. Melbourne and Sydney are made of multiple little business centers.

Brisbane seems to be trying to develop places like Chermside and Indro into business centers, but they too are really "inner" suburbs.

But I walk to work, and the wife uses public transport, so road congestion doesn't worry us.

I dont think Brisbane is that bad for roads, I work in the valley and live just on the edge of Taigum

Some days it takes me 15 minutes to drive home, others 30 (best & worst respectively)
There was one day that it rained really badly and it took nearly 2hrs to get home but thats once in a blue moon and due to retards who just can't deal with two things at once

In the mornings it usually takes no longer than 25 minutes to get to work straight up sandgate road

I walk and/or bus to work dpending how lazy I am.

I think trog is showing his experience being bought up in the inner western suburbs. In that area where majority are metro workers, his public transport system is tops.

However the further out you go from the cbd his solution turns to s***. Brisbane isn't a city in a european or japanese sense, it's an oversized country town. This means that a japanese/european model woulldn't work, we need roads at this stage.

Cliff notes:

Inbound - public transport suffices
Outbound/roaming - No way jose.

last edited by fade at 13:02:32 01/Oct/09

I think this should be the addition of the railnetwork. I don't really need to go inbound, i need to go north west, sometimes even east.

http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/gg195/skythra/railsystem.jpghurr

Berlin nailed it IMO - big overground around the outside, criss-crossing underground and trams in the middle. Accessible in a wheelchair by elevators which go from street level to underground platform.

http://img42.imageshack.us/img42/8940/berlino.jpg

that does look good in theory

Germans got to rebuild in 1945 though.

It's the megacity mentality combined with the aussie dream of a house with a yard. It's worse in Brisbane because we really only have a single business center ie. the CBD and apartment living relatively uncommon. Melbourne and Sydney are made of multiple little business centers.

Brisbane seems to be trying to develop places like Chermside and Indro into business centers, but they too are really "inner" suburbs.

yeh that is a really good point too. Maybe that could be fixed by creating a second "CBD" somewhere and trying to encourage business to move out there?

whatever, airport lounge posty guy

Maybe that could be fixed by creating a second "CBD" somewhere and trying to encourage business to move out there?

I guess there kinda trying to do that with places like springfield with the big shopping centre and University and stuff, cept they forgot to actualy put in the train line, I think its planned to go in eventually.

yep it is

someone forgot to tell them that building these things in places like inala (lol springfield lakes) and northlakes (lol dakabin/kalangur) is a pretty good excuse to never visit

inala (lol springfield lakes)

I think you are confusing forest lake with springfield lakes, its quite a distance from inala, its closer to goodna, but so is brookefield which is meant to be a posh type area.

Maybe that could be fixed by creating a second "CBD" somewhere and trying to encourage business to move out there?

u guys can have ipswich, ill stick with brisbane for my cbd

brookefield

Maybe you're confusing Brooke (a female's name) for brook (a stream).

Germans got to rebuild in 1945 though.

I just noticed this, lol.

brookwater, not brookfield

all those westside areas are s***. sif you would live in that dustbowl.

reckon, anything west of west end is fail

annything south of the river is mega fail

anything that isnt exactly where i eat/sleep/s*** isn't cool
you all aren't cool like me

brookwater, not brookfield

So he confused field (an defined area) with water (liquid substance)?

sif dan

someone forgot to tell them that building these things in places like inala (lol springfield lakes) and northlakes (lol dakabin/kalangur) is a pretty good excuse to never visit

Didnt you used to live in bracken ridge?

North Lakes actually isnt too bad, most the derro f***ers that you see around the area don't actually live there.

With the new police station around and the cops being real pricks too the teenage kids that wander round at night, its actually a nice place too live. Shame its a f***ing light year from the city and the road is so stupidly congested on the bruce highway and gateway that it takes me an hour to get too work every morning.

Shame its a f***ing light year from the city and the road is so stupidly congested on the bruce highway and gateway that it takes me an hour to get too work every morning.

wtb trains amirte

Brook-whatever-the-f***-it, you know the place im talking about, near springfield

wtb trains amirte

Unfortunatly for me, I use my car for work and my office is in george street, which makes it even more frustrating. If I didnt have to take my car to work Id take the motorbike instead.

In regards to trains, Petrie Station (Which is the closest too northlakes) does not have enough parking to meet the demand of train travellers that have too drive too the station. So I guess QR needs to take that in too account.

Didnt you used to live in bracken ridge?

nope, I'm looking at buying a place there soon though
Its one of a few places around Brisbane that I like and can still get 600+sqm blocks with a 3-4 bedroom highset house & pool for < 500k

It's a nice area but the transport anywhere near there sucks balls
good thing I drive everywhere

the ridge is just down the road from the salsberg!
old mate at work just sold his house there for 330k
pool, 3 bedroom, 600sqm
needed a bit of work though;

commuting from our area to work/city/valley, couldnt be easier;

fairfield rd has f*** all traffic 99% of the time, i breeze into work in like 15 minutes (to west end) and i dont have to ride on a s***ty train or bus and it costs bugger all in petrol

southside woop woop

lols, was thinking of acacia ridge

last edited by Spook at 14:44:50 02/Oct/09

There is no traffic because its s*** and no one wants too live there spook.

yes, the southside isnt over populated

Northside has more aldi's as well :D

the ridge is on the northside just fyi

sounds sucky (lols, i was thinking of acacia ridge)

I hear sunnybank is overpopulated :D

isn't that how the locals like to live though?

There is clothes lines strung up across the roads everywhere.

There is no traffic because its s*** and no one wants too live there spook.

And all the Nigerians walk everywhere.

^^ Sudanese.

Mate at fairfield got B&E'd the other night. Police caught him...when he came back later for more phat loots.

Spoiler: it was a sude.

edit: Westside (Auchenflower/Toowong/Indro) ftw

those norty chocolate bickies!

Spook, you just made my day with that comment.

f***ing GOLD!

coming into the thread late..

but how is this for an idea.. they quadruple the fines.. since retards who speed will speed reguardless of laws.. that would bring in 2 billion a year.. which they could use to fund the development of automated roads where cars of the future drive them selvesdown at the speed limit!!

actually we need more money for that lets increase the fines 10X

I LIKEY!!

also after just completing a road trip of EU i can say that the best driving behavior on the whole are the french.. the autobahns sound cool but dont work in practice

last edited by Superform at 16:44:11 02/Oct/09