Admin, can you please clarify the following points please.

1. We will be using 1.03 in the finals?

2. Blizzard have declared Tree-Walking a Bug. Will you allow people to exploit this bug?

http://forums.battle.net/war3-general/posts/mw/131728.shtml)http://forums.battle.net/war3-general/posts/mw/131728.shtml

That link shows Blizzard's verdict on it.

3. What is the deal with substitute players, can anyone replace your partner if your partner cant make it?

4. For those of us that don't follow the football codes, what is the finals structure.

Thanks for clarifying all these points, and here's to a great Finals.

can someone tell me what the hell tree walking is?

the finals isn't til the end of november.. well even that wasn't a definate yet so i doubt anyone has devised a finals structure yet...

Actually, they did have the structure, they said it was like AFL finals.

As for tree-walking, its selecting your ghouls in a battle, then clicking on a tree behind the enemy. Your ghouls walk Through the other guys forces with No-Clipping and then you can taget the casters or hero at the back.

Taken from Afl.com.au

Final eight:
The new finals system works as follows:
In the first week all eight teams play. The games pit first against fourth, second against third, fifth against eighth and sixth against seventh.

The top four sides on the ladder after the home and away season are guaranteed a double chance after the first week of the finals. The top two teams will play in their home state.

Teams finishing fifth to eighth will not have a double chance and will need to win four successive sudden death matches to win the premiership. Teams five and six will have home state advantage in the first week of the finals.

The winners of the games first v fourth and second v third proceed straight to the preliminary finals in week three. The losers will receive the double chance and play in the semifinals in week two.

The games fifth v eighth and sixth v seventh will be cutthroat elimination finals with the losers being eliminated and the winners proceeding to the semi-finals. The remaining three weeks of the finals will be cutthroat.

The winners of the semi-finals in week two will proceed to the preliminary finals, while the losers are eliminated. Winners of the qualifying finals host the games. Those rights, however, are not guaranteed. Winners of the two preliminary finals move into the AFL Grand Final, while the losers are eliminated.

The Finals structure will probably, and should be based on previous leagues, such as last years.
It seems that Boxheads description is basically the deal.
The real issue here, is about substitue players- which I don't think is viable, as teams are only of 2.

Player importing/drafting, anyone? I hope not.

i dont think players should be able to sub.. at the very least, they should have needed to play at least 3 league matches in the team to be eligible to play in the finals.

oh, and the finals structure should be:

1v8, 2v7, 3v6, 4v5

why should 5th place have a harder match than 8th place... doesnt sound right.

ermm where does 5th place have a harder game then 8th place?? they're playing each other... The afl system is about putting bums on seats... the games made with spectators in mind.. close games means more spectators and more revenue

1.03, so we can expect to see a bunch of ud/ud vs ud/ud.

I hope an admin reads this...
We need some clarification =]
As you can see there is mixed views on all the points I brought up.
I like the style of finals Boxhead Described though.

I think the 1v4, 5v8 etc stucture, just like QGL Finals last year, is the better.
Agreed, Draxy.

You're lost striker...

1v4 and 2v3 is played to decide who goes straight through to the preliminary final (the match before the grandfinal) and gets a break ... It is not an elimination match.

5 v 8 etc *are* elimination matches, in effect it rewards the teams who finished in the top 4 with a double chance.

my mistake.. i didnt read afl rules properly.. its a stupid game anyway :D

so i cant compete in the war 3 tourney @ QGL?? cus i havent had a team playing int he league?

so i cant compete in the war 3 tourney @ QGL?? cus i havent had a team playing int he league?

The Warcraft 3 tourney will be the finals for the top 8 teams from throughout the league.

1. We will be using 1.03 in the finals?

We will be using whatever is the latest patch out at the time. So that's currently 1.03

2. Blizzard have declared Tree-Walking a Bug. Will you allow people to exploit this bug?

I'm not sure myself, but I'd put it to the players to decide for themselves. Comments?

3. What is the deal with substitute players, can anyone replace your partner if your partner cant make it?

The general rules are that you must have played 2 out of the 3 games for your team to be able to play in the finals. If you cannot field a full team for the finals, you will unfortunately forfeit your position.

Thanks for clarifying all these points, and here's to a great Finals.

We're hoping the finals will rock, hopefully as much as the 2000 finals did. We have some pretty cool stuff planned to make it truly feel like a different event than the usual QGL, so stay tuned!

We're hoping the finals will rock, hopefully as much as the 2000 finals did. We have some pretty cool stuff planned to make it truly feel like a different event than the usual QGL, so stay tuned!

will there be pie involved?

My thoughts on tree walking : Its a bug/cheat, its been clarified as being a bug by blizzard, its a bug that only 1 race (undead) can exploit, and its a bug that will be fixed because it takes away so much strategy from the game. The farm bug was considered cheating, whats the difference with tree walking?

Tree walking Ghouls totally negate your front lines, it makes it impossible to siege a base against a competent player because the Ghouls can simply walk straight past your meat shield and kill the catapults. Your hero is also totally vulnerable to tree walking, so is your ranged units. Ranged units take 150% damage from Ghouls, the whole point to ranged units is keeping them in the back defended by your meat shield (grunts, footmen etc), so they can attack from range.

I doubt anyone will be able to post a reason to keep tree walking in, and I think we should be very suspect about whoever tries to, they will prolly rock up to QGL planning to go double undead.

It would be great if we could get an answer though, because I sure as hell will abuse it if its left in and want to get as much practise as possible.

Also for anyone who is wondering me and hall will be there for the finals. I think it would be a shame for a team not to be able to compete because someone cant make it to the finals though. Especially after that team went to every qgl and supported the leauge previously. Remember there has been only a few QGL's held that had the wc3 leauge, so its not unreasonable for a person in the team not to of had a chance to play. We started out with 3 people in our team, we just never had cause to use the sub. Whatever though, I havent heard from anyone that they wont be able to attend. Also hopefully the tree walking bug will be remedied by then as well with a patch.

I say let the best team win (not the best cheater :P )

Someone's Vehemont =]

Yer, Its a bug. Leave it out.

Although, I do wanna see Clipto play undead... ^_^

sif play QGL warcraft comp =)

*cough* bulls*** rush comp *cough*

There would of been way less rushing in a 1v1 comp, but everyone seemed to want 2v2 so thats the way it went.

Also theres so much room for gay tactics in 1v1 unfortunately, and you just cant get away with them in 2v2s usually.

'specially on those maps =]

Do the high level players do the cheesy stuff in ladder clipto?

Can someone explain to me exactly what tree walking is? I'm such a n00b when it comes to Warcraft 3 now, haven't played for ages :(

saint:

As for tree-walking, its selecting your ghouls in a battle, then clicking on a tree behind the enemy. Your ghouls walk Through the other guys forces with No-Clipping and then you can taget the casters or hero at the back.

Tree walking is in the game and unless it gets patched then its gonna happen in the finals...
we dont like it but thats probably hows its gonna be.

so what your saying is "If theres a cheat in it, then they are allowed to use it unless the game is patched first"

Ah f***ing cmon, thats BS, and for a competive CS palyer you should know this. Imagine if gl_zmax wasnt found out until you were on the flight for WCG to korea... when you got there you didnt know about it,a nd everyone was using it.

Think realistic. Not stupid.

Zoix, Exactly.

They just say "Tree walk" and you forfiet. Simple as that.
If you wanna contest it, save the replay. It's quite obvious when you tree walk.

Draxy: have u got any replays of tree walking? I wanna see it :D

could u upload a replay somewhere, link me to a website, email me one or tell me to get bent :)
hemerage77@hotmail.com

also, are you at QANTM atm? i didnt know u came here till yesterday :P

(12.4)

i reckon if u use the exploit, u cheated and should be kicked from the comp..... or just bash anyone at QGL who does it :D

Treewalking 101

http://users.bigpond.net.au/draxy/treewalk.w3g

Watch the second battle at the human base. the ghouls will walk through the mage. THen later, completely surrounded while attacking the alter, they will walk through a few grunts and straight through the hero and then have the Hero trapped.
Im Playing as The_Preacher in this replay.

draxy ... are you at QANTM?
thx, ill check the demo out when i get home

I should be =] but no Im at home today.
Ill think I have to go in this arvo for a meeting tho.

what classroom are you usually in?

suprised it took me this long to find we go to the same place :D

13.1 I think.
Striker is in my group (2).

Im doing the programming strand, and am currently helping out on a vehicle combat game.

so what your saying is "If theres a cheat in it, then they are allowed to use it unless the game is patched first"

first of all its a bug/exploit, not a cheat - cheats require game modification or codes.

second of all, im not saying they should be allowed to use it if its not fixed, im saying you wont be able to prevent it from happening. It can be hard to tell, I've been cursed for supposedly treewalking, when I had in fact not...

Hmm.. actually, its easy to spot.
Save replays if you think someone is doing it.
BNET newbs think ppl treewalk if you choose undead and have 1 ghoul ^_^

Its totally easy to spot, its very obvious when its being done. The only people who could miss it are casual observers...

So do we have a verdict or what?

.. On what?

If you wondering if forestwalking will be allowed at QGL, it's a part of the game - Blizzard have acknowledged this themselves.

Another patch is likely to be out before the finals anyway - which will probably resolve this concern.
But it's hardly something that can be monitored by admins, unless in a semi finals/finals [due to numbers].

LoL, How can it people think its hard to stop people treewalking?

You see it a mile away, and we save replays. Its like saying, dont be a moron just cause the admin isnt looking over your shoulder.

I will report any cheat that uses it against me and demand that the issue be resolved. Blizzard have stated its a BUG officially.

Just because you can EXPLOIT THE BUG doesn't mean you HAVE to. Anyone caught using it should forfiet their game. Cheaters have no place in gaming. Otherwise whats the point in playing. If you allow Tree-walking, you may as well cancel the finals while everyone learns how to do it, because most people don't do it as its a cheat.

We need a verdict on this now Saint. Or any Admin.

I wanna know if I should start practicing how to best exploit this BUG to its full potential, or should I just practice warcraft III how Blizzard intended it to be played.

If you wondering if forestwalking will be allowed at QGL, it's a part of the game - Blizzard have acknowledged this themselves.

Blizzard has said "it has been classified as a bug", just like the farm bug was. How can you argue its part of the game and that it should be allowed to stay, and then say it will probably be removed come the patch?

Huge games like these always have bugs, and they are never allowed to be exploited in tourneys. Would you of argued for use of the farm bug? Would you of argued for use of the Open GL bugs in CS? Give me a break...

Maybe the forums should be split up into categories like all the other forums around. That way the admin would spot it easier.

its easy to admin the bug. the teams just have to be aware of it. then record the replay and show an admin if it is used against them.

i think it should be illegal to use.

Another huge advantage creep walking give is it lets you kill a lot of creeps a hell of a lot easier.

you mean tree walking. and i dont think it helps much against creeps.

Zoix may be referring to the changed ai that creeps have in 1.03, its not very hard to trail high level ones back to your base and own them there earlier on than usually possible before.

It makes it very easy to totally surround a creep and kill him, being able to focus totally on the big creeps is a big advantage, as it lets you kill them really quickly... Usually you would only be able to get a few guys in to attack the big guy, and you would have to finish them all at the same time, this way you can pick them off one at a time.

Also by killing the big creep first you get the item straight up, which means if your interupted its no big deal.

Its like how its way better to attack creeps with ranged units because they can focus fire, but with none of the disadvantages of ranged units...

Well, so far we have the majority behind DONT USE IT, with the others resigned that it is a bug that can be exploited, but dont know how to police it.
As the rest of us can clearly see it for what it is, I think admin should make a comment now...

Since tree walking has been assessed by Blizzard as a bug it is illegal to use. As mentioned previously, saving replays is one of the best ways to highlight people cheating / expoilting bugs and should be done for EVERY match (most have been anyway). If there is any contention during a game, either pause and get an admin, or continue playing with intent to win and submit the replay for appeal at the end. Don't just abandon a game on the suspicion of cheating.

Hopefully a new patch will be out by the 30th to remove treewalking anyway, but in general anything declared bugged or abusive behaviour by the designers of the game will not be allowed in QGL comps. If there are other exploits that people are concerned about, raise them either here on the forums or at the start of the competition and they will be ruled on then. Typically the majority decision will be followed.

Excellent. This is great to hear =]
Thanks for clearing that up for us VRBones.

Sweet, cheers for the clarification.