what are those forums we used to go on with all the bike information and stuff.. i can't remember.. it was an Australian one im pretty sure.. just have a total memory loss..
ta.!

http://www.overclockers.com.au/mc/forums/

http://www.netrider.com.au/forums/

:)

The overclockers one is the main one, I was also on www.krsc-au.com as my bike was a kawa.

You thinking about getting a bike again? :D I miss riding sometimes, however with 3 deaths on OCAU in the last couple of months its a little discouraging :(

ausbikes.com

ozsportsbikes.com.au

Yep i knew two of the people who died from rides. Very unfortunate, they were great people and we had a great time with them at the wedding, one of them met another on OCAU and they married. The wife died.
I still say the only reason anyone dies on a motorcycle is lack of ability.
she use to have a problem with target fixation, where she had crashed times before.
Boky was a good rider, but still rode harder than most. He was in QLD at the time and didnt know the roads. Lowsided and collided with a oncoming car.
Take care on a motorcycle and you will be ok. But if your numbers up, even sitting at home on a computer won't save you.

But if your numbers up, even sitting at home on a computer won't save you.

That's about as f***ing stupid as playing russian roulette, shooting yourself and saying "oh well, my number was just up, would have happened if I was just sitting at home on the computer anyway!"

Riding a motorbike is dangerous, it has nothing to do with your ability, there are far more uncontrollable factors on such things as a public road.

I could flog the s*** out of you on a BMX at a skate park in ability, but if we were both then to ride on a public street it would be completely different even if we both had excellent road sense/knowledge. Every other person out there that is driving or riding is just one of the many uncontrollable variables that has nothing to do with "ability" The point of this piss weak analogy is the point that, even with identical 'road' skills but vastly differing co-ordination, balance and riding/handling skill there are risks that are beyond what 'ability' can help you with.

Not to mention, it's just f***ing common sense that a car offers more protection than a motorbike.

I honestly reckon you fit the type of person who shouldn't be riding a motorbike Vash. Immortality complex/misconception that the real danger of a motorbike is solely in the hands of the rider.

I'm now going to 56k death this thread with a gif of me riding awhile ago ^________^
f***s me why it plays super-fast in firefox and a cool slow-mo in IE. And I don't care.



last edited by Loki at 16:15:16 08/Feb/06

German who are you on Ausbikes?

I dont know if I'd ride to commute daily ever again, but I'd definately do track days/ride dritbikes and the occasional spin if I get the chance.

As much as learning to ride a motorcycle and surviving a crash has increased my road awareness and I know firsthand how easy it is to come off, its the other traffic that really concerns me the most.

However if I had the chance over again I would always choose to go the same path again cause it was an awesome experience and I very much enjoyed it all apart from the trip to hospital :)

I know Mav's situation in life is a bit different to most of ours and if learning to ride is something you really want to experience Mav I'd say go for it 100% you will absolutely love it!

last edited by rubba-chikin at 16:42:30 08/Feb/06

I'm selling my CBR250R if you are interested in buying such a bike mav. Drop me a message if you want more info.

Its simple. Don't ride hard and ride within your ability and youll be fine, in every situation. Same on public streets. Be aware, dont ride fast, leave gaps. EASY AS THAT. There will be situations where someone will have bad luck, oncoming car has a heart attack and goes bang head on into you. your dead, and most likely are in a car too.
If you aren't capable of controlling yourself on a motorcycle you shouldnt be riding one. I am able to control myself so i am able to.

tominator, im only only ozsportsbikes.com.au not ausbikes.

On ozsportsbikes i'm either german or damo. haven't been on there for quite some time...

I got those links from a mate who is on them.

There are situations like oil/gravel on the road that can take you down too, I guess that could fall under bad luck. You have been down before have you not Vash?

Most riders will go down at least once or twice due to things like that in their lifetime even if they are super careful.

The main problem is 2 wheels doesn't stand up by itself which makes it a lot more dangerous in respect to getting hurt when you do get out of control.

Out of curiosity how much you selling for thunder? The thought of getting a bike again often does cross my mind but things like the 2 recent deaths on ocau have swayed my choices so far.

last edited by rubba-chikin at 17:23:00 08/Feb/06

oncoming car has a heart attack and goes bang head on into you. your dead, and most likely are in a car too.

It's more than just a random chance of someone having a heart attack and coming at you from side on.
All you need is someone to sideswipe you, knock you off and get run over.
Or how about alot more likely - car suddenly turns in front of your green light, you T-Bone him.
Have fun even at 60 clicks going straight over the bars or straight into his/her car head first.

Don't think it can happen? I'll dig up pictures of my car back in 01 or some year that say otherwise.
If it was a motorbike, you'd be f***ed up, broken bones, death, paralysis... all a
HELL of alot more likely than if you were in a car, all because of someone else's fault...

Man, you really do have the "I'm a good/careful rider therefore I'm immortal" thing happening. I think korbs (could have been someone else) from here had a low speed accident on a motorbike due to someone else's fault which, if I remember correctly. What would have just been a bumper scrape in a car was more terrifying and dangerous on the bike.

But you're right, having all that steel around you in a car is purely aesthetic and has no physical protection value whatsoever compared to jeans and a helmet.

Don't get me wrong, I rode rubba's moto a little bit and it was awesome fun, but f***ed if I'd ride one on the roads with all the people who can't drive for s*** out there.

last edited by Loki at 17:29:03 08/Feb/06

how many years have you been riding motorcycles on the road loki?

I'm looking for $4,500 at the moment. After looking around thats the general going price for a 1988 CBR250R (import) with fairly low KMs. It's in pretty good nick and amazingly I avoided dropping during my time riding it. Chuck me an email address and when I get home I can send pics and some more details if you want. Definitley a fun little bike, but I hardly ride it anymore. Life has other plans for me.

So demon, let me get this straight, you've never, not once in your life driven aggressively?
If it's fast enough and aggressive enough to do serious harm to a pedestrian who suddenly runs in front of you, it's enough for to do the same damage to a motorcyclist.


The issue here isn't how good a rider you are or think you are.
Some people ride all their life and never have an accident...
Some people drive all their life and never have an accident...

That has stuff all to do with their driving ability, accidents usually involve one person at fault and another who was in the right for a reason.
Rear ended, sideswiped, car suddenly turns in front, car runs a red light, whatever the case is.
Reaction times and vehicle reaction times says that not all accidents are avoidable.

Two people don't just meet at a set of lights and say "hi, how are ya? LETS HAVE A f***ING ACCIDENT, OK?"

no. the issue here is you thinking that you know the probabilities of having an accident on a motorcycle better than vash who is an experienced rider. i don't know vash personally but i am sure that after such things as riding trailies to tasmania he has a firm grip of what to expect on the road while riding a motorcycle. vash is merely saying he feels confident on his motorcycle... he never says that an accident is impossible.
if you think that riding a motorcycle on the road is an unacceptable risk then fair enough, don't ride. but don't go preaching to riders who have accepted the risk because you speak from ignorance.

The only times i've crashed my bike is from riding fast and unsafely. When i was on my Ls i came around a bend abit quicker than i was confident of and lowsided.
2nd time i was on another bend on my Ps and fanging it abit. Came off again going beyond my confidence.
Ever since then I've ridden safely and have never had a close call. I commuted to work for 2 years and never had an incident. this is sydney peak hour traffic im talking about, you don't mess around there.
3000+ km trips interstate, no problems. I'll come off alot offroad but thats just the properties of offroad terrain and you dont really get injured. its actually pretty fun crashing offroad :)

tominator, im only only ozsportsbikes.com.au not ausbikes.

On ozsportsbikes i'm either german or damo. haven't been on there for quite some time...

I got those links from a mate who is on them.

Ah ok just thought I might've have met you at some stage, guess not lol.

don't go preaching to riders who have accepted the risk because you speak from ignorance.

exactly

on road, yea sure its got its risks but so does everything.
i dont limit my life just because someone else MIGHT destroy me, otherwise i'd never go outside...

Vash my thoughts: if you dont fukup offroad your not going hard enough ;)

last edited by Fuknukle at 19:06:31 08/Feb/06

no. the issue here is you thinking that you know the probabilities of having an accident on a motorcycle

No, read again you complete idiot.
I never said you are more likely to have an accident on a motorbike, actually you probably are, but only marginally due to visibility reasons. Your chances of survival, however, on a motorbike in the event of an accident, are far less, or the possibility of injury, far greater.

It's just pure basic physics that a car offers protection, plus I have worked with alot of spinal patients who were from motorbike accidents, but I speak from ignorance of course...
Sure, cars have their fair share of these injuries, but there are more people in cars than people on bikes on the road.

last edited by Loki at 19:32:30 08/Feb/06

let us give thanks to the internet god for lokis post limiter

Post Limiter what?
I was watching 24.

Thank god for bandwagons.

last edited by Loki at 20:26:04 08/Feb/06

I always hear about how dangerous riding motorbikes is, you think we don't know that?

The thing is, riding is just so much fun it's worth the extra risk. So until you're hooked we will all seem like a bunch of looneys :P

message sent thundercracker, send me some pics in email :)

The thing is, riding is just so much fun it's worth the extra risk. So until you're hooked we will all seem like a bunch of looneys :P

Yeah, as I said don't get me wrong, it's awesome - I rode rubba's moto and was very tempted to get one myself (I would still like to if I had the money).

I think the novelty would wear off on me (personal opinion) rather quickly, but my only point was, when someone like vash jumps on and says "omgz its liek totally safe and anybody who dies riding a moto its clearly is their fault and they had no skillz" they're twisting the truth and not being honest to a would-be rider.

my mum was a nurse
i was gonna get a bike, and she told me
that there are more people in casualty with motorbike injuries than heart attack patients

that put me off bikes for life
also
a bus vs a car = life
a bus vs a bike = death

a bus vs a pedestrian = death

o o, better not walk anywhere...

or run

or pushbike

or walk the dog

last edited by Fuknukle at 00:21:27 09/Feb/06

Everything in life has an element of risk to it, if there wasn't any it would be a pretty boring place.

It all boils down to how much of a risk you are willing to take, its as simple as that. If you beleive it is too risky to ride a motorcycle then don't do it... end of story.


Thing I miss the most is lane splitting at lights :( So cheaty :D

hehe it makes such a huge difference in travelling time especially peak hour.
no more stopped on the motorways, no more missing lights due to too much traffic, no more late for work. and all for only 10-15 bucks a week

loki: you're not only ignorant but also stupid & lacking in some basic comprehension. i can only hope that the mods up your post limiter to a week or so... or someone insults you enough to throw another e-tantrum & e-leave the forum... for good this time though plz you waste of space.

Care to elaborate on that, demon ? I don't see what is wrong with what loki is saying.

Thanks korbs,

He's just behind the times and jumping on an old bandwagon.
I shouldn't have replied to his first troll, and won't be to his second.

i was gonna get a bike, and she told me
that there are more people in casualty with motorbike injuries than heart attack patients

I wouldn't say that's the exact truth from my own experiences working in hospitals, including working in Spinal and Cardiac separately.

In spinal, alot of the young blokes I spoke to, alot of them had motorbike accidents (whether it was trailbike/roadbike). These guys aged from 18 - 24 as an average, some of them regret having ever been on a bike and you couldn't blame them when at that age, they can no longer walk.

On the other side of the fence, one young kid there who absolutely loved his video games, spoke with me for quite awhile on ends about games and consoles [In a spinal unit you actually seem to find alot of spare time to interact with the patients], his story was that he actually took a 'brb' pause from online gaming to go to the shop in his car - He lost fine motor control over his hands and fingers and can't play properly anymore, total loss of function in the legs.

One other very young kid was from diving into surf and hit a sand bar, was then a paraplegic.

The majority of them were from motorcycle accidents, but as rubba said - everything has it's risks, of course even cars have their fair share of injuries, but the ratio of people who have an accident in a car with minor to no injuries compared to a motorbike in a similar accident, is a much better one.

last edited by Loki at 13:37:31 09/Feb/06

i cant see what is right with what he says, in this thread or any he embeds his ignorance in. but here is elaboration, even though to me it is obvious.
Vash post saying that if you take care riding a motorcycle you will be ok, he adds a philosophical note about the inevitability of everyone's mortality.
loki responds with the atypical non-motorcycle rider diatribe about the horrifying danger of motorcycling... to an experienced rider that would know the dangers all too well! he adds that his M4D BMX skills give him phat street credibility! hahah :D
vash responds by saying that as long as you are alert there is no reason to commence your funeral arrangements as riding a motorcycle is not a death sentence despite what ignorant noobs may think!
loki then launchs into a post about how cars are inherantly safer than bikes & how the damage, in the event of an accident, will be worse on a motorcycle... why? i really don't know. no one said they weren't or even hinted at it. & for certain, every motorcyclist knows this anyway... a lot better than loki.
then i asked loki how long he has been riding to highlight his lack of experience.
loki doesn't answer the question but instead asks me if i've ever driven agressively & that its would damage a motorcyclist as bad as a pedestrian... once again i have no idea why! it has nothing to do with what i asked. then he once again explains that accidents aren't foreseen... geez I DIDNT KNOW THAT!?!? heheh :P
so i try to explain to him that it is pointless for a non-motorcyclist to preach the dangers of motorcycling to an experienced rider... & that if he thinks motorcycling is an unacceptable risk then just 'don't ride'. you are an experianced motorcyclist korbs... what do you say when some 18yo comes up to you & says "you're not gonna ride that DEATH MACHINE on the road are you , you temporary australian!" ;)
loki then attempts to quote me out of context... at first i thought he was being humourous... but as i read further it was obvious he lacks that subtlety & once again flaps his gums about how much safer cars are than bikes...
i give up n just call him a cretin.

last edited by demon at 13:44:00 09/Feb/06

Hi Demon!
I'm going to reply to your troll, here it is.

If you read, you'll see I have worked with the people who come off motorbikes and suffer possibly one of the worst injuries I could imagine, alot more frequently than in cars... this inherit information statistically tells you a motorbike is more dangerous, a simple grasp on common physics also stipulates that a car offers more protection than a motorbike... but of course, I'm speaking of ignorance because I haven't actually ridden a bike very much...

In fact, I would like to go so far as to say, I have dealt with more of them, and seen more of the aftermath of riding motorbikes, than you, who has the ignorant 'it won't/can't happen to me' attitude.

Furthermore, the bike analogy (you DO know what an analogy is don't you?) was exactly that, a weak analogy to show that actual co-ordination, balance and control over the vehicle can be vastly different between two people, and still be involved in the exact same, unavoidable accident (thereby refuting the argument that... "as long as you know how to ride and have skills you won't die!").

Since you missed it twice already here it is again:
You're probably not much more likely to have an accident on a motorbike than a car.
Although, how many people do you know who have had a car accident? how many have you been in? How many times have you actually fallen off a motorbike - and simply lucky a car wasn't coming the other way, or tailgating to run you over etc.

Motorbikes are, statistically and through use of incredible super-common sense that most people seem to have, and you lack, is that motorbikes are more 'dangerous'.
But, you will continue to preach to people that it is perfectly safe when you should really be saying "yeah, it has alot of risk to it..." and informing people who are considering riding of the dangers.

Hey Demon, I went driving yesterday and I didn't have an accident... IT MUST BE PERFECTLY SAFE!

Thanks demon. While he may not have handled the argument to your satisfaction, i don't think there is anything incorrect or ignorant about his statements.

you are an experianced motorcyclist korbs...

Not a biker any more, sorry. I was in an accident (sideswiped by cab changing lanes out of f***ing nowhere) which i was unable to avoid. Luckily my gf (riding pillion) and i escaped with only minor injuries, but it scared the piss out of me and i sold my (repaired) bike soon after.

What do you say when some 18yo comes up to you & says "you're not gonna ride that DEATH MACHINE on the road are you , you temporary australian!" ;)

Don't use hyperbole to make it seem like non-bikers are all ignorant twats. If somebody came up and told me that riding is dangerous and i was much more likely to die in the event of an accident, i would tell them that i agree completely, but thats a risk i am willing to take because i love riding so much. I certainly wouldn't try to retort with some rhetorical "everyone dies when their number's up" pseudo-philosophy. ;)




last edited by korbs at 14:33:11 09/Feb/06

I shouldn't have replied to his first troll, and won't be to his second.

course you will.. you can't resist e-drama you queen.

& so, another long winded post about how motorcycles are more dangerous than cars.. ho hum. you said that before & i read it & i didn't disagree with it the first time.

if skill & attention wasn't a factor in the cause of accidents & the deciding factors are these 'unknowable third party factors' then why do most accident happen to people between the ages of 18 & 25?

if skill & attention wasn't a factor in the cause of accidents & the deciding factors are these 'unknowable third party factors' then why do most accident happen to people between the ages of 18 & 25?

What has skill and attention got to do with it?
I could put a rider who races motorbikes on a track for a living onto the street and tell them to flog it around the streets for a few hours, the chances of them crashing are far greater due to 'unknowable third party factors'.
18 - 25 are more likely to be aggressive themselves on the bike, implicating speed and other dangerous manouvres...

...However, Korbs' accident is a testament of why I asked "have you ever driven a car aggressively?" Because people do, and they aren't careful, and might just swerve into your lane quickly and angrily even if you are being sensible and careful.

Korbs may be right in saying that I didn't handle it as perfect as you would have liked, but my point is how korbs summed it up particularly in the last part of the sentence in saying:

i would tell them that i agree completely, but thats a risk i am willing to take because i love riding so much. I certainly wouldn't try to retort with some rhetorical "everyone dies when their number's up" pseudo-philosophy. ;)

last edited by Loki at 15:41:19 09/Feb/06

If you put a professional track racer onto the streets, and he has no street experience, he is more likely to crash than an everyday commuter who rides sensibly to work in the city. But if your just talking about going for a fang around the country twisties, yes there are more factors; but same for a car racer.

Off the street skill and on the street skill are two different things.
I don't race dirt bikes, street bikes or stunt, i ride for recreation, and i'd say i have certain alertness skills to avoid most accidents, but once again not all are avoidable.

s***, all i wanted to know was the bike forums, and it's turned into a 2 page argument

what thread doesnt