hopefully this is old news to you guys and you can tell me when it will be done in and around brisbane, that is when will the water be fluoridated? does anyone know?

Water fluoridation does not:

Cross image cause cancer or bone damage
Cross image affect the taste or smell of water
Cross image cause allergic reactions

lol at this crap, numerous studies and one or two done by me indicatae the taste is signicantly different and it causes decreased brain function/ kidney damages/ other crap you dont want that far outweigh the benefit of 'better' teeth.
l1nkz0r

you've done a study into this i see are you a dentist or in the medical profession?? if not f*** off.

I thought all australian non-bore non-tank water was already fluridated, just like they add whatever it is to our flour.

I won't be drinking fluoridated water.

I don't agree with it... they're going to do it anyway... so I just won't take part in it.

Simple as that, no whinging needed.

last edited by CHUB at 21:33:42 13/Feb/08

its all about mind control and the government controlling the masses
gees, don't you know any of your conspiracy theories???

Yeah I don't want to drink it either, it's like any other chemical .. while a small amount is fine, a greater amount over time isn't. Water filters ahoy!

I'm all for it

What's bad about it?

I drank fluoridated water in Canberra. I'm still smart, I don't have cancer, I don't have bone damage nor do I suffer from allergic reactions. My teeth are fine.

im for it

I dont really care. I assume smarter people then me (in this field) have made the appropriate checks and balances.

So i'm not against it. I wouldn't of fought to bring it in though.

Harden the f*** up and just drink it. It's not like Brisbane water could taste any f***ing worse anyway.

i spent a total of 17 years of my life drinking flourinated water and I'm still fine... *twitch* *twitch*

^ but you're a fish thats not the same

I drank fluoridated water in Canberra. I'm still smart, I don't have cancer, I don't have bone damage nor do I suffer from allergic reactions. My teeth are fine.

Are you sure? :p

Wait, so CHUB will happily ingest street-drugs of made of draino bubbled through antifreeze but turns his nose up at Fluride? lols.

chub is chub

Heard on an ABC radio station, apparently you'd need to drink 17 times the recommended daily intake of water everyday to be poisoned by fluoride.
34 liters of water anyone?

obviously its not that deadly but i would rather drink water without it

f*** off reverend, what so i dont have a job in the field so im not allowed to know something about it? go read some rules again :P

just didnt want to get a one sentence first post and have people complain the other way with no info

Harden the f*** up and just drink it. It's not like Brisbane water could taste any f***ing worse anyway.

You obviously have never travelled have you :p

Heard on an ABC radio station, apparently you'd need to drink 17 times the recommended daily intake of water everyday to be poisoned by fluoride.
34 liters of water anyone?

That's to be 'instantly' poisoned. The effects Spock etc are talking about are over a longer period of time. Like anything else (eg smoking), they aren't saying "you will get these symptoms", they're saying "you have a higher chance of getting these symptoms".

I drank fluoridated water in Canberra. I'm still smart, I don't have cancer, I don't have bone damage nor do I suffer from allergic reactions. My teeth are fine.

You did not live in Canberra all that long, and probably only had your kiddy teeth around ;P

Granted I lived there most of my life, my teeth are crap and well not so sure about the rest of me, could be due to genetic f*** up.

I believe there was a march of something in the city to protest it? Any one know how it went?

You obviously have never travelled have you :p

Well actually, I come from Cairns. I've been around a decent chunk of Australia, and as well as New Zealand (never been further overseas than that), and Brisbane most certainly has the worst tasting tap water I've ever come across. It seems to be even worse now that water supplies are dropping, like it's got more chlorine in it or something. Seriously, I'd say it's at least the most foul tasting water in Queensland, closely followed by Goldsborough Valley Estate near Cairns (heavily chlorinated bore water).

I'd say it's at least the most foul tasting water in Queensland

AAAHAHAHAHAHA
I've just come back from 3 days in Kingaroy
I couldn't even spit after brushing my teeth with that s***.

oh dear.

the backward smart state is putting flouride in the water. Maybe we will finally catch up to the rest of the country now?

I'd say it's at least the most foul tasting water in Queensland

When I first moved up here, we used to drink the left over ice from the servo, that was used to keep our food refridgerated and it even tasted better than Brisbane water.

Then f*** off back down south you dirty mexican.

That's to be 'instantly' poisoned.

Note I said everyday. To suffer the symptoms of fluoride poisoning you would need to drink 34 liters of water everyday. As in a life long daily routine.

Probably deserved that comment, have always had to mumble where I came from so as not to get put down. However not being a politician, a business person or a uni nerd, I no longer fit into the world of mexicans.

we distill all our water before drinking it, the taste is dramatic, and once you see all the s*** at the bottom of the distiller after you have put a few leters of water in it you will never drink water straight from the tap again.

Did you people never play in the dirt as kids?
Harden The f*** Up.

dont knock brisbane water till you've tried the s*** that comes out of taps in london!

Did you people never play in the dirt as kids? Harden the f*** up.

Hmmmmmm, you don't strike me as the type that would drink much "water". Maybe something else clear. So if I put it in terms you can understand. It is like drinking a cheap ass vodka compared to one that has been tripled distilled.

dont knock brisbane water till you've tried the s*** that comes out of taps in london!

isnt there water fluoridated

i know its recycled.

I work outside, I drink water plenty. All from the tap.

I work outside, I drink water plenty. All from the tap.

Well Kudos to you my friend, I will stick with my filtered water, however snotty that seems.

Granted in the bigger scheme of things, I am glad our water flows separate from our sewrage and is treated. Yes, compared to that we have water from the gods.

i thought most studies found that it didn't really improve tooth decay problems or have significant other effects. but in dr.strangelove, flouridation of the water supply was described as the most monstrously conceived post-war commie conspiracy!
hmm.

qld children have the worst teeth in aus.

qld is the only state that doesnt have fluoride in the tap water.

harden up.

i thought most studies found that it didn't really improve tooth decay problems or have significant other effects.

My question then is, why then do they have fluride in almost all toothpastes?

i thought most studies found that it didn't really improve tooth decay problems or have significant other effects.

i think that's with adding it in water...
with toothpaste it's actually on your teeth longer than just water so you actually get more of an effect with that than just drinking water with trace amounts of flouride...
i could be totally wrong though

My teeth are fine.

so are mine and i dont drink fluoridated water!


parents need to stop being such lazy c***s and teach their kids how to brush their teeth properly. plus they should stop feeding them junkfood for dinner.

The truth be told, I didn't brush my teeth very much growing up. Got a little bit of staining, other then that they are fine.

I'm guessing your genetics have more of an impact on how well your teeth fair then any fluoride put in water.
What you've eaten just prior to brushing your teeth could possibly have an even greater impact again. Doing something like drinking orange juice then brushing your teeth really owns them. The sugars in various foods and drinks interact with the bacteria in your mouth which then produce lactic acid which in turn lowers the general pH of the mouth.
This acidic environment starts to demineralize the tooth and brushing it with a tooth brush further aids in the destruction. It is better to let your mouth pH return to normal levels before brushing. Drinking water and eating alkaine foods like cheese sticks helps this procress.

bout time imo

You kids haven't made it until you get daylight savings up ya!

numerous studies and one or two done by me indicatae the taste is signicantly different and it causes decreased brain function/ kidney damages/ other crap you dont want that far outweigh the benefit of 'better' teeth

Can you link to some of this study info? What studies have you done on it?

numerous studies and one or two done by me indicatae the taste is signicantly different and it causes decreased brain function/ kidney damages/ other crap you dont want that far outweigh the benefit of 'better' teeth.

I wish people wouldn't quote the same s*** I wanna argue :(

dudes - go drink some fluridated tap water in say... Tassie.

then come home and drink the s*** you and everyone you know is used to and tell me we don't have a very f***ing serious problem with our water distribution up here.

seriously - there's water. then there's our water. I've always hoped that more Mexicans coming into the state would highlight this:

what the f*** gives water that s*** taste here in Qld???

do they mix it with bore water or something?

man qgl loves a whinge

nothing wrong with drinking brissy water from the tap, im hoping and expecting the flouride wont change the taste

i drink s*** loads of water from the tap, i fill my water bottle at work straight from the tape and happily drink it at my desk all day

im from cairns originally and dont notice the difference between cairns and brissy water

Brisbane water is fine, if you haven't had water from other places. Some water I've had overseas is the most disgusting s*** I've had, especially in Florida. Alot of people there don't drink tap water, they buy it. I've heard from a few people that water in Tasmania tastes awesome, we should copy theirs ;)

what the f*** gives water that s*** taste here in Qld???

Possibly the dirty, decaying pipes?

I've been drinking filtered water for a while now, hadn't drank straight from the tap in over a year. Then I was at my sisters place, I was thirsty, they have tap water. Poured myself a cup and I was stunned by the first sip. It was very, very ... tasty.. in a bad way.

Filtered water ftw!

Wait, so CHUB will happily ingest street-drugs of made of draino bubbled through antifreeze but turns his nose up at Fluride? lols.

Hey, I got perfect teeth... no fillings at all, I'm not worried about tooth decay.

Just because everybody else can't keep up simple dental hygeine shouldn't mean I'm forced to ingest harmful chemicals.

ol at this crap, numerous studies and one or two done by me indicatae the taste is signicantly different and it causes decreased brain function/ kidney damages/ other crap you dont want that far outweigh the benefit of 'better' teeth.

bahahahah, can i see one of your studies please?

if fluoride really had some kind of statistical impact on the rates of these things don't you think this would have been found in other areas that have been using fluoride for long periods of time?

Hey, I got perfect teeth... no fillings at all, I'm not worried about tooth decay.

i remember you had massive problems with grinding your teeth matey

that doesnt sound like perfect teeth to me . .. .

I grew up with fluoride in the water everyday. I drank water everyday.
Stop whinging about cancer and liver disease, etc.
I'm sure one night on the drink causes more damage than 10 years of fluoride water (which you have minimally anyway).

i remember you had massive problems with grinding your teeth matey

that doesnt sound like perfect teeth to me . .. .

Na I never grinded my teeth, I chewed my tounge.

qld is the only state that doesnt have fluoride in the tap water.

You mean Brisbane. I am pretty sure most of QLD has flouride in the water. I know where I am from did (Stanthorpe).

bahahahah, can i see one of your studies please?

the only study i did was taste testing the water difference between here and sydney and all the others i was just talking to someone else who read them or reading the net :)

http://www.wholywater.com/fluoride.html
http://www.thyroid-info.com/articles/shamesfluoride.htm

An increasing number of practitioners have identified fluoride as a health concern, and more jurisdictions are fighting fluoridation of water, citing health concerns. In addition to believing that fluoride can cause a variety of health problems, you both have long held that fluoride can trigger or worsen hypothyroidism. Can you explain a bit about how and why fluoride can negatively impact health, and specifically the thyroid?

bla bla bla i hate fluoride

Yeah I don't want to drink it either, it's like any other chemical .. while a small amount is fine, a greater amount over time isn't. Water filters ahoy!

I bought a water filter a couple months ago and actually RTFMed, the fine print says it'll filter out lots of stuff but might lead to increased levels of potassium in the water. If its not one thing, its something else!

Maybe you need a water filter to filter the filtered water!

I want like what they have in the Slurm episode of Futurama - a big tank of H2 and a big tank of O

Just did a quick search through one of the databases we use for research here at work... The general finding is that fluoride in water is good.

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention have named fluoridation of water as one of the 10 most important public health measures of the 20th century. Nearly 100 national and international organizations recognize the public health benefits of community water fluoridation for preventing dental caries.

the yellow colour to the water these days is interesting due to the water level dropping

yellow?
man im out here in pine rivers (yee-ha) and my water is tasty and clear

Haha QLDers really will fight hard to resist change.

IF WE DON'T ALREADY HAVE IT THEN WE DON'T f***ING NEED IT, amirite?

How the hell we ended up with computers and electricity and s*** is beyond me.

i hear electricity lines cause cancer and make you dumb n s***

water taste & clarity varies throughout brisbane depending on how crappy your mains pipes are. the water in my area is pretty aweful, bit yellowish & sometimes smells a bit swampy but it actually tastes very neutral. at my bro's place the water is really clear & has a strong chlorine taste to it. i have no problems guzzling either... my innards will work it out :D

i reckon just like chlorine (which is a deadly poison) the trace ammounts they put in general water supplies isn't gonna do the majority any harm.

peace on earth. purity of essence.

you've got a good point demon. it does vary in brisbane.
at my parents house, you have to run the tap for a minute in the morning to get all the yellow water out. water tastes pretty average there too. they also have a 45year old house with crap water pressure in a gully.
at my house, water is absolutley prime. clean, clear, tastes nice, top water pressure, but i'm on top of a hill (direct line of sight to mt cootha from my front yard) and i own a modern home (mid ninties) so probably has good polypipe not crappy old metal crap

Yeh screw electricity and fluoride and all that stuff.

I'm gonna go bush. Ohs***, will I need an aboriginal?

i haven't found the yellow colour varying anywhere, i don't think thats a water main issue

reckon just like chlorine (which is a deadly poison) the trace ammounts they put in general water supplies isn't gonna do the majority any harm.

yeah thats the winning point, chlorine would have to be worse than flouride for you

how long have we been drinking chlorine?

http://www.wholywater.com/fluoride.html
http://www.thyroid-info.com/articles/shamesfluoride.htm

Yeah...those aren't studies. When you said studies..I figured actual links to published studies with statistics and whatever. For each of those sites you can find others saying the complete opposite....

Brisbane water tastes like ass. We buy all our drinking water, only use tap water for cooking and cleaning etc.

Even at work we have a Billi system that provides filtered and chilled water, so I never have to drink it. Except when you go to restaurants that use tap water, and you can really taste the difference.

As for the flouride thing, I dont drink the water anyway, so meh.

I thought all australian non-bore non-tank water was already fluridated, just like they add whatever it is to our flour.

Iodine is added to flour.

Brisbane water tastes like ass. We buy all our drinking water, only use tap water for cooking and cleaning etc.

this is a good video for you
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XfPAjUvvnIc

... if all of the zomg cancer and other rot was true, then it was should show up in statistics somewhere that places like Melbourne and Sydney had signifcantly higher numbers of hip fractures or cancer. But they don't so it must be statistical insignificant.

How the hell we ended up with computers and electricity and s*** is beyond me.

Porn.

I just hope they don't use industrial grade fluoride

nice work jim

man im out here in pine rivers (yee-ha) and my water is tasty and clear

aha! No wonder I couldn't understand why people were saying our water is so bad. Cheers to living in PRS

I remember the water that came out of the taps in thailand looked like kava, and people are crying about a bit of fluride in their water.

I've always noticed a bit of a chloriney taste with Brisbane water, but if you drink it cold it hardly matters.

Now Adelaide water...that stuff tastes like it came straight out of a pool.

Of all the water supplies I've tasted, Melbourne's was the nicest. Cairns (where I grew up) comes a close second.

Santa Clara water here used to be great, but has deteriorated in taste, and has become much harder (mineral deposits and stains on every glass, plate or fixture)

im from cairns originally and dont notice the difference between cairns and brissy water

Are you f***ing serious? One of the best things about when I go home to Cairns is that I can drink out of the tap without it tasting like a public swimming pool. If you can't taste the difference, there's something wrong with you. Hell, even just coming from the Gold Coast to Brisbane has a noticeable drop in water quality. If you're from Edmonton, maybe I can understand, as most of the water I've had there tasted like old pipes. Gordonvale and Cairns though have fantastic water.

For the record, I don't care either way about fluoride in the water.

One of the best things about when I go home to Cairns is that I can drink out of the tap without it tasting like a public swimming pool.

I recall it being a common practice that when peeps would come back to college after a xmas break in Cairns, bringing back a couple of bottles of Cairns tap water to ration out..

those were some gay peeps

Yeah, I remember when I was a kid, when we'd come down to Brisbane for a family holiday, we'd bring heaps of water with us. It was never enough though :(

EDIT: Jim is gay.

Cheers to living in PRS

Agreed. You, Me and Tollazor know its the way of the future

fluoridation of the water is just another part of the new world order's scheme for total control by a single global government.

it is well known that fluoride affects the neural connections in the area of the brain which enables rational independent thought.

gradually as fluoride levels increase in the general population they will become more susceptible to illegal actions of the government, and become incapable of resisting.

the future is indeed bleak.

Agreed. You, Me and Tollazor know its the way of the future

yeah wow go pine rivers

haha

I've heard over the years on radio and TV (it must be true!) when the argument had been brought up, that using toothpaste twice a day for 5 or 10 years has you ingesting more fluoride than what you'd get in a life time of drinking fluoridated water.

So having it in the water is of no real concern to me, since (according to this anecdotal evidence) I'd already have poisoned myself with toothpaste far more than I ever could with water.

All about risk/benefit ratio i guess. Im against it, i dont think there is any real evidence to suggest fluoridation of drinking water decreases tooth decay. Some studies i have seen on topical fluoride use (ie - toothpaste, tablets etc.) have found no benefit with fluoride in drinking water.

Its been brought up a few times at the hospital, most of the doctors seem to think its a bad idea...i tend to agree.

Which Hospital, What kind of Doctors and Have they done specific research in the field.
A Cardiac Surgen has about as much knowledge in this area as Elmo.

doctors know everything!

Studies have proven there is nothing to worry about... What medical conditions do people in other parts of the country have that we don't have...

You do realise that EVERYWHERE in Australia, apart from most of Queensland (Townsville already has it too) has been living with it for a long time...

I just came out of hospital recently for a kidney stone (oh my f***, most painful thing you can imagine)

article

Study Finds Link between High Fluoride & Kidney Stones

A new study (see below) published in the journal Urological Research, has found an association between high levels of fluoride in the water and painful kidney stones. According to the study, urolithiasis (kidney stones) was 4.6 times more common in an area with high fluoride (3.5 to 4.9 ppm) than in a similar area without high fluoride. Moreover, in the high fluoride area, the prevalence of kidney stones "was almost double in subjects with fluorosis than without fluorosis."

imo, anything you can do to reduce kidney stones is a bonus++
I grew up in NSW, we had fluoridated water

http://www.health.qld.gov.au/fluoride/images/map.gif

In NSW the water is at 1.0PPM

imo, anything you can do to reduce kidney stones is a bonus++

such as, no fluoride > any fluoride, not just lots vs. not much

Bezzar are these doctors north of noosa ?

imo Garbage men, sewage and a clean stable water supply have done more for public health and increasing the average life expectancies then any surgeons.

But ...

Water fluoridation is supported by the World Health Organisation (World Health Assembly, 1978), the Australian Dental Association, the Australian Medical Association and the National Health Medical and Research Council.

So these doctors would no be of a similar mind to their professional body or their main research group.

ps. fluoride is found naturally in water in some places in the world in concentrations 2 to 3 times higher then they are talking about here.

Which Hospital, What kind of Doctors and Have they done specific research in the field.

No i can't say they have a PhD in the area of water fluoridation, that would be silly right? I can only say that from their own research (as in reading up on studies from reputable sources not all the s*** you stumble upon when you use the google), they were convinced the possible health problems linked to water fluoridation were a greater risk than the proposed benefits.

The hospital and what kind of doctor seems a little irrelevant.

It seems from pursing various articles from Pubmed adding fluoride to the water (About 1ppm) has benefits and draw backs. The benefits are along the lines of reduced tooth decay while the draw backs are a slightly increased risk of fluorosis. The majority of studies show that the benefits far outweigh the risks and is worth putting into the drinking supply.

I want like what they have in the Slurm episode of Futurama - a big tank of H2 and a big tank of O

I'd prefer tanks of H and O2 myself.

Also, Hinze Dam > Wivenhoe Dam.

The hospital and what kind of doctor seems a little irrelevant.

Child/Trauma/Paternity Wards would have less general information then say, a research facility specifically setup to test if water fluoridation will cause significant adverse affects.

But hey, what do scientists know, they're not real doctors, right?

Oh ffs. I grew up on flouridated water and I'm not dead. In fact, if you've ever left the backward state of QLD, you've probably drank flouridated water.

Catch the f*** up. You're doing well by having things like coffee shops, night clubs and an ability to buy things after 5pm during the week. Go the rest of the way and get some nice water and daylight saving up ya!

RAAARR!!

Yeah I grew up on flouridomificated water too and dentists are always impressed with my teeth as they are much nicer than the scungy teeth qlder kids have.

Yeah I grew up on flouridomificated water too and dentists are always impressed with my teeth as they are much nicer than the scungy teeth qlder kids have.

Nothing wrong with my teeth, or the teeth of most of the people I know. Maybe you shouldn't be such an egotistical generalising c***?

Hahah ...

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/a/a1/Unholy_three.png/355px-Unholy_three.png

Why is this even a debate, we are supposed to live in a democracy, if you want fluoride its easy to get it, f*** its in like 99% of toothpastes, i cant see how adding it to the water is going to help people who are too lazy to look after thier teeth.

How about we ban people from feeding their kids s*** quality sugary food all day instead? Punishable by a sharp kick to the nuttsak.

If you don't want it then you should have that choice, govt making health decisions for us is FTL.

If you dont want it, buy a filter?

Works both ways.

that's one of the dumbest posts in a while tmwnn, especially the closing comment

what a pack of girls, I grew with fluridated water most of my life. I also don't see massive death rates in north Queensland because of it either.

I dunno if Jim is trolling, it's hard to tell lately. But TMWNN's point of view about the government intefering in our health is true and important but I love my flouride anyway and my super strong teeth, imagine how strong they would be if I still lived in Adel... uh, out of the state.

Well, this was retarded:

i cant see how adding it to the water is going to help people who are too lazy to look after thier teeth.

It really implies a fundamental lack of understanding about why they fluoridate water. How can you not see how adding a proven dental remedy to the waater supply will help dental hygiene?

Also one of the KEY responsibilities of Government is public health! If the gov. doesn't do it who should?!

I think what he meant, that even with Fluoride in the water, people who never brush their teeth or eat too much junk/sugar food are up s*** creek anyway.

I say, Who gives a f*** about them?
It's going to help me and any future offspring I may (god help us) spawn.

It's excellent to have the government making and enforcing health decisions because many people are lazy, ignorant or plain stupid when it comes to health and hygene and it only takes a relatively minor percentage of people in a population to have any kind of negative impact on the health of a much larger percentage of a population.

Think about the comment "govt making health decisions for us is FTL" beyond the scope of whether or not to add flouride to a city's water supply and consider it in other contexts such as standards for water supply, sewerage, waste disposal, quarantine, food production, health care... the list goes on. All of these areas have laws which dictate practices and standards within them - not just recommendations.

its already in almost all toothpaste. get the f*** over it.
fluoride ftw

why don't you get over it reload!







if that is your real name.

so the toothpaste i use has fluoride in it (active ingredient sodium fluoride). that doesnt mean i swallow it every day when i brush my teeth. you rinse and spit it out.

arent fluoride filters around 600?

last edited by Spock at 23:30:50 15/Feb/08

you reckon you dont inadvertently swallow some every time you brush?

Also, they are putting it in a concentration of 1 ppm. Look at it this way:

1 mL of fluoride and 999,999 mL of water. Cry more.

so the toothpaste i use has fluoride in it (active ingredient sodium fluoride). that doesnt mean i swallow it every day when i brush my teeth. you rinse and spit it out.

Unless you scour your mouth for an hour after you brush you will be ingesting much more than the amount you will get from the fluoridation of water.

You know that nice clean minty taste in your mouth after you wash? Residual toothpaste.

Think about the comment "govt making health decisions for us is FTL" beyond the scope of whether or not to add flouride to a city's water supply and consider it in other contexts such as standards for water supply, sewerage, waste disposal, quarantine, food production, health care... the list goes on. All of these areas have laws which dictate practices and standards within them - not just recommendations.

There is no reason multiple private corporations couldn't do this much better. Microsoft could manage your health better than Campbell Newman, and probably at a more competitive rate.

they don't have the authority for starters, nor was that the point TMWNN made anyway. or did you already forget that that's why we're on this tangent?

tangets on qgl, who would have thought

Fluoride is already in toothpaste there is no need to introduce it into the food the farmers grow, the water we drink, and other things in the natural cycle of nature.

You know that Fluoride is naturally found in water... right?

I hear Jim has a 4WD? Is that true? Pics or Lying!

I heard that he did and it's banned in Vic!

can you buy a water filter that puts 1ppm of fluride in your water?

the Qld govt's old fight over the evils of fluride in water ended some time ago, mostly because they look like idiots to their peers in Canberra.

now it's all about the expense.. state and fed govt don't want to implement it, and councils cry poor that they would like to but can't afford it

that's one of the dumbest posts in a while tmwnn, especially the closing comment

Dumb post are my specialty.

Some people are happy to have other people make their health decisions, good for them and more power to em.

Some people like to decide for themselves, IMO that choice is just as valid.

My point still stands that if you don't look after your teeth already fluoride isn't going to magically mean you have healthy teeth, so why bother, give everyone free tubes of toothpaste instead, or subsidise dentists or some s***.

Or give the $10mill or so its going to cost every year (including the propaganda on tv and radio) to me instead, I bet you it will have the same effect on dental health in the community.

I bet you it won't

My point still stands that if you don't look after your teeth already fluoride isn't going to magically mean you have healthy teeth, so why bother, give everyone free tubes of toothpaste instead, or subsidise dentists or some s***.

it's actually about bring up kids with it from the start, not about you

Provide an incentive for people not to feed their kids sugary s*** then.

$100 per year per kid as long as they stay cavity free.

There is an incentive, it's called not wanting big arse dental bills and a crying kid 24/7.


I really don't understand why people are bothered with it. The amount of other crap in unfiltered tap water is probably worse then the minuscule amount of fluoride that will/is put in.

You're a retard TMWNN.

well you can suck my balls then.

My point still stands that if you don't look after your teeth already fluoride isn't going to magically mean you have healthy teeth, so why bother, give everyone free tubes of toothpaste instead, or subsidise dentists or some s***.

hahaha wtf. Do you always think for the good of yourself only?

I think TMWNN has a point. I hate the government opressing me. (and i work for them lol). For example the water restrictions. Don't tell me what i can and can't do with my water. Give me a limit and then fine the hell out of me if i go over. Same with fluoride. Don't make me have it! Give me an option, give me other incentives like subsidised dental care etc.

For example the water restrictions. Don't tell me what i can and can't do with my water.

how would that work, given there's a limited supply? paying for the water you do get doesn't entitle you to as much of that limited supply as you want. what are you thinking there?

Same with fluoride. Don't make me have it! Give me an option, give me other incentives like subsidised dental care etc.

but it's not the same! it's a completely different issue. in this case, the govt deems that people aren't responsible enough to manage the issue individually, so it's something they feel they need to do for us - and it's pretty unlikely you're personally in a position to know better

isn't going to magically mean you have healthy teeth

But it does. Put fluoride in the water and magically dental decay in the general population decreases.

Also, because little Jimmy isn't going into the dental office as often there is a place free for when you need to go in. So it can directly affect you.

I'm thinking make the first 140L/day at a regular rate, then any amount over that at like $1000/L. If i want to have a 1 minute shower and then wash my car instead of a 4 minute shower, let me. My point is give me a situation where I can use no more than my small allocated portion, but let me do what i like with it.

I have no more an insight about people's attitudes towards dental care than you Jim. My point is, why if other people can't take care of their teeth right must I need to have fluoride in my water? And not just drinking water either, but in my radiator too etc.

If i want to have a 1 minute shower and then wash my car instead of a 4 minute shower, let me.

lol
yeah, like you're seriously going to use no extra water because you're going to be so disciplined that you ensure you don't. and everyone else in the region is going to be as disciplined as you

the idea is that you're supposed to only use strictly what you _need_ so as little as possible gets used. the easiest way to increase the chances of that happening, is to outlaw it's use for things we don't _need_

I have no more an insight about people's attitudes towards dental care than you Jim. My point is, why if other people can't take care of their teeth right must I need to have fluoride in my water? And not just drinking water either, but in my radiator too etc.

if you don't need it, you can safely ignore it

and thats why i say change the costing so the discipline is enforced.

also, I don't have the government tell me what i _need_. I tell me what i _need_.

if someone can reduce their required water use to less than your theoretical 140L, then they should do so, and refrain from using the remainder of the 140L on things they don't need. get it?

and you do have the goverment tell you what you need, for many things. that's because you're not in a position to be able to determine or enforce for yourself what you need for many things. you may like to think you are, but you aren't

cop it sweet

if you are dead against a teeny bit of flouride in your water supply or have some philosophical problem with the government tampering with your precious bodily fluids ... then get a rainwater tank n drink that or distil the supplied water.

And lets not forget that the levels of flouride they are talking about are less then is found naturally in some locations.

wheres that?

In East Africa, some surface waters have been reported
to contain fluoride concentration as high as 1627 ppm
(Kilham and Hecky, 1973). Underground and intersitial
waters are usually richer in fluoride than surface waters
(Bower and Hatcher, 1967, Windom, 1971).

waters in and around the United States have natural fluoride levels that range from 0.1 parts per million to over 12 parts per million

The tin foil hat people argue this not by denying it but arguing it is "natural fluoride" as oposed to man made ?

A crucial test was begun in 1945 in Newburgh, New York, to see whether deliberate addition of fluoride to a water supply which had very little natural fluoride would provide the same benefit. Over a 10-year period, the children of Newburgh developed nearly 60% fewer cavities than the children of the comparable city of Kingston, where the water was not fluoridated. Since then, thousands of studies of the effectiveness and safety of fluoridation have been made with consistent results.”

Benjamin Spock, M.D

hmmm

The tin foil hat people argue this not by denying it but arguing it is "natural fluoride" as oposed to man made ?

Yeah it s***s me when people try to make a distinction between a naturally occuring molecule, and a synthesised molecule, when they are actually the same f***ing thing. My girlfriend always goes on about the 'good cyanide' found in fruit - methinks it's the SAME cyanide just in very small doses. Let's see her try the natural 'good arsenic' :P

lol @ 'good cyanide'.

"good arsenic"

I am working in oncology at the moment and we are actually treating a patient's cancer with arsenic... So it can in fact be "good"!!

I strongly doubt you are

doesn't bother me my filter will get rid of it but there are enough fluoride toothpastes out there that if you want it you can get it your self not have it forced on you.

nah

All i can say is have a healthy look at what is contained in this website - http://www.fluoridedebate.com/

This is also an interesting read - http://www.powelltherapies.com/articles/flouride_research/change%20of%20mind%20on%20flouride.htm

Myself and many scientist type peoples (lectures and whatnot) have a good laugh at people who think putting the little itty bit of fluoride in the water is a bad thing. Half of them had fluoride pills when they were younger.

Silly peoples.

flouride in our water, a ferris wheel and a tunnel.

wow, brisbane is really going places.

If the government says it is a good idea it must be. If a man a white coat tells us we must believe it, he is wearing a white coat.

doesn't bother me my filter will get rid of it but there are enough fluoride toothpastes out there that if you want it you can get it your self not have it forced on you.

Sort of like how you force AMWAY on other people?

Fancis I think you'll find http://www.harold-holt.net/index.htm compelling.

The earth is flat http://www.lhup.edu/%7Edsimanek/fe-scidi.htm

And this just in
http://www.morebeach.com/images/stories/blog/180px-elvis_lives.jpg

It's on the internet so its true.

don't forget to read up on http://www.answersingenesis.org/ as well... it's full of people confidently spouting unsubstanciated bulls*** with authority! ;p

while we're at it, can we vote out the guy who brought in the conservation of energy law
f*** me what a stupid law

I have a perpetual motion machine in my garage!

has it had a positive effect on your teeth?

It discolours my pants ?

I'm against fluridated water for many reasons. But I realised that In terms of neurological effects Australia is an awesome testbed seeing as though we have places like queensland that have nearly 0 flourine that we can compare to other states on an Intellegence basis. All I had to do was google a national IQ study and it shows the following:

Smartest State
Australian Capital Territory 114
New South Wales 112
Northern Territory 110
Queensland 110
South Australia 111
Tasmania 111
Victoria 111
Western Australia 109

These results indicate theres no massive difference in IQ levels state wise, therefore it suggests there no link between fluorine and brain function. This is not to say theres no other health affects. But no one can really tell for sure because its produces extremely long term type ailments which are difficult to document.


link

^ I can't tell if this guy is joking or not.

gotta be joking imo... coz otherwise why say you're against flouridation & then post an article that proves absolutely nothing. also...

Yesterday 100,000 Internet visitors chalked up nearly 1.5 million page impressions at ninemsn’s Test Australia website. 26,000 players participated online in the National IQ Test 2003 on the night and helped make up the ‘snapshot of the nation’.

ninemsn traffic doubled today as many Australians who missed out taking the IQ Test when the show went to air, or those who wanted to try to better last night’s score, logged on to take the test online. The Test costs $5.50 including GST.

heh. not only proving nothing... but also making the sample irrelevant by limiting it to knobs that would pay ninemsn money for a phoney-baloney iq test.

lol classic. ^

i love the taste of brisbane tap water
and iv tasted greydens distilled and filtered stuff which is pure water, eww. i must be kuh-razy!

last edited by scooby at 17:11:42 14/Mar/08

im on rainwater

suckers!

i like brisbane tap water too

gotta be joking imo... coz otherwise why say you're against flouridation & then post an article that proves absolutely nothing. also...

Let me clarify. I'm against it for these reasons:

We have no choice in the matter.
We don't fully understand the health effects too well and there ARE studies to suggest it has negative affects.
We don't need it. for example: my teeth are fine.

however;

I disagree with the arguement that it affects peoples intellect.

simple stuff there.

so to answer my original question, does anyone know when this is going to be implemented?

We don't fully understand the health effects too well and there ARE studies to suggest it has negative affects.

But water that has these levels (and much higher) of fluoride naturally ... they are ok ?



This just in

Light bulbs are commonly believed to emit light from a heated filament, powered by electrons shooting through electrical cords from a wall socket or battery. Electrons in wires move far too slowly to do this, however, and it is the electromagnetic current that the electrons generate that turn on the light. The field is expanded and shaped by the tungsten coil inside it, but does not heat the coil. In fact, the electromagnetic field does not emit light, but absorbs darkness. The rushing darkness, impinging on the tungsten coil and the glass bulb, heat each of them.

Upshot: Light bulbs absorb darkness according to their power rating. The darkness accumulates until the bulb is full, then it breaks. Try to buy bulbs with more volume with the same power rating. They will last much longer.

But water that has these levels (and much higher) of fluoride naturally ... they are ok ?

obes,
Some water supplies have low levels naturally, some have high levels... In cases with higher levels they actually take out fluoride. Awesome.
The point is: I'm drinking more fluoride now than what I used to. And I don't want to based on these reasons:

We have no choice in the matter.
We don't fully understand the health effects too well and there ARE studies to suggest it has negative affects.
We don't need it. for example: my teeth are fine.

The end.

also it tastes terrible

What I thought you were joking about was the laughable use of a country's median IQ score to measure if fluoride affected brain function.

last edited by fpot at 07:00:47 15/Mar/08

Effect of fluoride exposure on intelligence in children
Li, XS; Zhi, JL; Gao, RO
Fluoride. Vol. 28, no. 4, pp. 189-192. 1994.

The intelligence was measured of 907 children aged 8-13 years living in areas which differed in the amount of fluoride present in the environment. The Intelligence Quotient (IQ) of children living in areas with a medium or severe prevalence of fluorosis was lower than that of children living in areas with only slight fluorosis or no fluorosis.

The above is an example, Imnt, of what should have been posted.

Also, the few negative fluoride articles I've read refer that the negative effects are caused by fluorosis. That is excessive consumption of fluoride.

I'm taking a guess, I would say that the levels of fluoride being put into the water are less then the amount it takes to cause fluorosis. Maybe you should find a few articles that explain the levels of fluoride needed to cause fluorosis.

well. not really. I still find a test that took 25000 people from a place i can relate to that broke groups up into pretty much fluoride drinkers and non fluoride drinkers more conclusive. Testing 800 children on IQ is also not going to give you accurate results. And ofcourse is not intended to draw such a specific conclusion like in your link - you need to make that yourself. If fluoride did have an effect on ones IQ, it would be somewhat detectable in this survey, It is by its own virtue (just like any other test) a valid source.

I'm taking a guess, I would say that the levels of fluoride being put into the water are less then the amount it takes to cause fluorosis. Maybe you should find a few articles that explain the levels of fluoride needed to cause fluorosis.

I've read in a few places it may be attributed to bone cancer and other things, I'd rather not even worry about that s*** in the first place because i dont need it.

obes,
Some water supplies have low levels naturally, some have high levels... In cases with higher levels they actually take out fluoride. Awesome.

Care to back that up with an example ?

Or did you just make up something because it better suited your arguement ?

We have no choice in the matter.

You can buy bottled water or get a raid tank or filter for drinking and better yet you can f*** off to some 3rd world country where they don't do it yet... so actually you do have a choice. But lets pretend for a second you don't.

I want to drive on the right hand side of the road ... but I have no choice in the matter.
I want to kill people who wear denim jackets with jeans... but I have no choice in the matter
I don't want to pay taxes ... but I have no choice in the matter
Sometimes doing things for everyone is better then catering for the individual.

We don't fully understand the health effects too well and there ARE studies to suggest it has negative affects.

The amount of water you have to drink at 1ppm to cause fluorosis is insane. Maybe if you took fluoride tablets, ate toothpaste for dinner and drank your body weight in water a day you'd get there.

I've read in a few places it may be attributed to bone cancer

Everything causes cancer... But see here's the thing, if that were true. Melbourne and Sydney would have statistically significant higher levels of bone cancer. But they don't.
The Osteosarcoma (spelling?)"link" is at best dubious (I've read the article). The author claims it only effects males 10-19. Not females, or people outside that age group. And claims counter studies on this rare cancer that says fluoride reduces Osteosarcoma and discounted by the author of this one because they only have 2 years of sample data. Other studies that said it had no effect he discounted because they were girls or anyone except 10-19 males.

Even the author points out its hard to actually to prove or disprove because Osteosarcoma is that rare. If there was a strongly defined link, and all those people drinking water everyday... and its rare ? ...

In all of this you have to be careful when playing with statistics based on diseases. Why ?
Skin cancer rates are higher in Queensland then Victoria. Queensland doesn't have fluoridated water, Victoria does ... there for Fluoride in the water prevent skin cancer ... right ?

We don't need it. for example: my teeth are fine.

Good for you.
There are quite a few people in Queensland who's teeth are not so fine, and a rotting teeth end up as systemic infections, And add to our over crowded hospitals. Large scale preventive public health measures (eg. sewage, garbage collection, reliable power, clean water) are more effective then treating the problems. Fluoride fits in to that category.

I'd rather not even worry about that s*** in the first place because i dont need it.

Seriously Harden the f*** up.

If you don't want it you have many options. (Or if you have a buggered kidney and are concerned about your body being able to deal with it)
Bottled water.
Rain water tanks.
Water Filters.
or GTFO

I live in Queensland, and took fluoride as a kid. I go 5 or 6 years between dentist visits... and the dentists still go, "so you had flouride as a kid"



last edited by Obes at 10:30:22 15/Mar/08

f*** me, your a real dick, It's good to see I wasted your time. I'm not responding to what you wrote either, lets just leave it at that.

f*** me, your a real dick

chicks say this to obes all the time, although it's not usually until he's dropped his dacks

Imnt has made up his mind that fluoride is bad, regardless of any research done.

i love the taste of brisbane tap water

i like brisbane tap water too

Wow... I never thought I'd ever hear someone say that. What surprises me even more is that you, Spook, who hails from Cairns, can say that you like the taste of Brisbane water. Crazy.

f*** me, your a real dick

chicks say this to obes all the time, although it's not usually until he's dropped his dacks

It's more an exclamation of surprise, because they don't expect him to have one.

seeing your quote made me re-read what I'd typed - I meant to type chicks with dicks

I haven't read the thread but I'm assuming theres a little posse who are against fluridated water and all I can say to you guys is,


HARDEN THE f*** UP YOU SKIRTS

You are placing too much value on IQ tests. IQs don't measure how smart you are, they just measure your ability to perform IQ tests.

Compared to a lot of other places, Brisbane tap water isn't bad at all. I lived in Cairns for 5 years and Innisfail for 2 so yeah their water is uber. But Brisbane is still a s*** load better then some of the crap in the US.

Also lmnt, seriously ... harden the f*** up.

BTW they run the water through copper pipes!
that copper has to leaching in, and copper is a poison to just about everything! We are doomed@!#@!@!#@!#@#@

Daying light saving causes curtains to fade!

r u drunk obes

HARDEN THE f*** UP YOU SKIRTS

Daying light saving causes curtains to fade!

It confuses the cows as well... and Jo.. and Flos pumpkin scones.

Wakey wakey QLD!

An interesting article was just published and thought it worthwhile to bring back this thread.

First-ever government review of fluoride/thyroid toxicology shows risk

So it seems now there is actual evidence that fluoride in water is bad.

"The recent decline in iodine intake in the U.S could contribute to increased toxicity of fluoride for some individuals," says Thiessen.

Could the iodine added to our flour help counteract this?

HARDEN THE f*** UP YOU SKIRTS

Actually it's the opposite, everyone else should harden up and look after their own teeth instead of polluting the populations water with f***ing poison because c***s eat too much candy and drink too much coke.

shutup d*******

Shhhh Jim

I had a very good argument to bring to this thread the other night actually, but i forgot what it was so yeah.

Fluoride water tastes better too

So it seems now there is actual evidence that fluoride in water is bad.

I googled the chicks name in that PR and she's one of the ringleaders of some worldwide anti-flouride campaign; I'd like to see a rebuttal from some more scienticians on the other side of the fence

Yeah, it'd be interesting to get the actual government report, was it linked in any of the references of the article? (I was too busy (read: lazy) to check.

Dear government,

There is no point putting fluoride in the water because people with terrible teeth don't even drink water. They drink coke, coffee, mountain dew etc. It is safe to assume that the healthy people who drink water do not need fluoride as they brush their teeth, go to their dentist and exercise on a regular basis.

Also please do not block my internet.
Also please provide me with superfast internet.

Sincerely,

Concerned Citizen.

Dear retard^

The point of puting flouride in the water is not to benefit the adults now with bad teeth, it's to help prevent kids getting bad teeth.

the pave

Is it nearly Daylight Savings Time? I miss that debate, too.

so everyone who has a thyroid problem & has used flouridated toothpaste should be able to sue colgate n the rest amirite!??!? do yas rekn that 'study' would stand up in court n stuff!? :P

at least you're not drinking ur own wee wee i reckon

reckon

Dear retard^

as if you would take my dear government notion/letter seriously

Let me clarify. I'm against it for these reasons:

We have no choice in the matter.
We don't fully understand the health effects too well and there ARE studies to suggest it has negative affects.

Imnt,

Is there ANY evidence that the level of fluoride being ingested through water (assuming the average person does not drink more than 2L/day) is SIGNIFICANT enough to cause damage through accumulation? If so, what are the side effects AND is this con worse than the pro of preventing dental caries? (a rly big prob in qld btw). Keeping in mind, dental disease is now considered to be very closely linked to heart disease (heart disease is second greatest cause of death in Aust, 20% of population is currently dying from it).

Fluoride has been in the water for over 30 years in some parts of the world (namely America). What have studies of fluoride in the water over there shown? Pros and cons.

Would be interested to hear what you have to say seeing as how you feel so strongly against fluoride in the water. I'm assuming you've done a bit of reading.


last edited by Agent 99 at 08:56:31 21/May/08

at least you're not drinking ur own wee wee i reckon

you are an idiot.

if you think the water you drink every day hasn't been inside some other animal at sometime in existence you are kidding yourself. people with your irrational objections are the reason why governments remain weak on the issue of water recycling and instead embark on costly and environmentally damaging desalination plants.